The Online Tatting Class http://www.chatzy.com/695768390662 Visible contents as of 10 Sep 2010 17:41 UTC-05:00 (217 KB) Page 1 of 5 · Char 1 to 51235 · Newest posts at the bottom ============================================================ AKTATTER cleared the room 28 hours ago AKTATTER joined the chat 28 hours ago AKTATTER: Sept. 9, 2010 AKTATTER: The special event with Mimi Dillmann will begin at the next hour. Pull up a seat and stand by to learn cluny tatting from a master tatter! Elipand joined the chat 28 hours ago Elipand: hello Paige left this message 28 hours ago: Hi! omar joined the chat 28 hours ago Brenda joined the chat 28 hours ago Brenda: Hi JaneEb joined the chat 28 hours ago Brenda: Hi Jane JaneEb: Hi folks Elipand: hi da tatter left this message 28 hours ago: Hello fellow tatters Elipand: hello AKTATTER: hello all AKTATTER: I am checking for messages from tatters who need help to get here. AKTATTER: keep your seats it won't be long now AKTATTER: da scroll down to the bottom and join chat please AKTATTER: it is so good to see you all brb Tatmantats joined the chat 28 hours ago Tatmantats: just poking my head in the door :-D Elipand: k Tatmantats: to see who is here. Can't stay long. Gotta go back to work marytats joined the chat 28 hours ago AKTATTER: I ask you now, who could forget the password was tatting? LOL back to the inbox AKTATTER: thanks for those links Mark Brenda: just off to make a cup of tea then back to enjoy!! AKTATTER: oh my goodness 18 minutes to go I;m so excited brb Cynthia joined the chat 27 hours ago Cynthia: Hi AKTATTER: hi ya Cyn how are you feeling? Elipand: hi Cynthia: lots of us need to learn clunys! Good today Cynthia: brb doublechecking to see if anyone needs my help getting in too marytats: 10th Anniversary Tatting Day at Zig-Zag in Greenfield, IN, October 9, check out www.tattingcorner.com AKTATTER: oh my Cyn, I have had so many requests for the password LOL tatting! how could they forget, I sent a general note around a few minutes ago. Still checking the inbox Cynthia: I know me too AK even I have brain blanks about that! Brenda: back ready to start Cynthia: Did Bludragon get in touch AK? AKTATTER: no bludragon Barbara M joined the chat 27 hours ago Elipand: k Cynthia: Hi Brenda glad you could make it. I appreciated your note as well... Barbara M: Hello, everyone. I am soooo excited to have help with this beautiful pattern. Thenk you so much. linda joined the chat 27 hours ago Brenda: I have been waiting all week for this. wouldn't have missed this for anything. I meant every word linda: Hello Everyone! AKTATTER: ok that was it for the inbox. I am so glad to see so many familiar faces and even a couple of new one! Cynthia: just to reassure everyone you can do a SCMR--sounds scary but is really easy. AKTATTER: Jane how are you doiling? Barbara M: Phew! Good. AKTATTER: Jeanne?? z?? Cynthia: Tatman has some awesome patterns too and he is so generous with us! AKTATTER: Mary Jane good to see you mjb joined the chat 27 hours ago mjb: Hello everybody., I am back in business.,,,,computer working again Elipand: k skfuller joined the chat 27 hours ago skfuller: Wow Hi Everyonbe jeanne left this message 27 hours ago: Hi Everyone. My first time here. Cynthia: for those looking in click on join chat and every so often "k" in so the room knows you are still here AKTATTER: Aliz, you live in WA do you live close enough to join the Lacemakers of Puget Sound? AKTATTER: jeanne scroll down and click on join chat please jeanne joined the chat 27 hours ago Paige joined the chat 27 hours ago AKTATTER: glad to hear it mjb Brenda: k skfuller: It's wonder to see so many tatters here! AKTATTER: Hi ya Paige so good to see you jeanne: Thanks. Didn't realize that. Sorry. Paige: Hi. AKTATTER: Sue long time Cynthia: awesome that so many newbies are here. Leticia joined the chat 27 hours ago mjb: Did Dorcas get ahold of you? skfuller: My first 2 lines and already so many typos Yikes AKTATTER: Leticia glad you made it to the class AKTATTER: lol don' Leticia: yeah! da tatter joined the chat 27 hours ago AKTATTER: don't worry I hold the record for typos Cynthia: To get people here I refuse to let the pattern out until close to class...no scary stuff Bernice joined the chat 27 hours ago Elipand: k JaneEb: Sorry I forgot I was here!!! Doing fine, Georgia - very busy 'after dad'!!! Cynthia: you should see the tuypos I take out!!! LOL AKTATTER: you know what I have been thinking about the scmr the self-closing mock ring Bernice: Hi, AKTATTER: i think we ought to rename it Cynthia: what? Cynthia: I keep telling the beginners it is a chain masquereding as a ring.... AKTATTER: chain turned into a ring CTIAR AKTATTER: so let's call it CTIAR but pronounce it "STARE" mjb: good name skfuller: Hi Georgia I've been chatting with a few others this summer doning the beginners class AKTATTER: ohh maybe CAKAR Chain aka Ring Cynthia: it isn't so scary that way....then it could be a SMR??? but the Shuttle Brothers called it a first! AKTATTER: that's super Sue I know that you could help them with questions Elipand: k AKTATTER: errrrrr welll now the Shuttle Bros called their creative version of it scmr picotsnkeys joined the chat 27 hours ago picotsnkeys: hello everyone Cynthia: Hi Melanie Elipand: hello Shanan joined the chat 27 hours ago AKTATTER: but histroically speaking some tatters once knew only how to make the chain and they just folded it back on itself and joined calling it simply a ring da tatter: this is the first class for me, is the pattern posted somwhere? skfuller: I was supposed to be at a tatter's get together in Montana right now but had to cancel my trip at the last minute Shanan: looks like a full class today! skfuller: so I'm so very happy this special class is today! AKTATTER: Camp Wannatat? what a shame but hopefully you can go another time Cynthia: bummer sue was it at camp wanna tat by any chance AKTATTER: Shanan howdy! Shanan: Hey AK! skfuller: Yes, my husband and I were going to drive but he found out he had to work at the last minute AKTATTER: DA did you complete registration recently? da tatter: yes skfuller: Thought about driving by myself but it would be a 14-15 hr drive and just didn't feel like that linda joined the chat 27 hours ago Shanan: I can't stay the whole class because I have to run and pick up my nephews from school AKTATTER: Cyn no bludragon but I got a the dragonsden registered?? AKTATTER: Judy welcome Cynthia: that is the pits but we have you here to help us... too bad I wasn't still in longmont O'd hjave gone! stitchingsharon joined the chat 27 hours ago stitchingsharon: Hello everyone. Gina joined the chat 27 hours ago Gina: hi y'all :) skfuller: That would hadve been great Cynthia Shanan: I wonder how non-homeschool moms get anything done! These kids get out at the craziest times!!! Mimi joined the chat 27 hours ago stitchingsharon: I'm so excited to be learning clunies! I did not sleep well today, and will pay for it at work tonight. AKTATTER: da I can't find your name did you get an info letter from Me? Maybe I forgot to send it? sunela joined the chat 27 hours ago Mimi: Whewee, sorry if I'm late. What a morning. sunela: hi all AKTATTER: Gina!! Sunela! Mimi!! Bernice: k skfuller: Hi Melanie Cynthia: Hi Mimi welcome to ghe gang AKTATTER: da type your email address for me and I will go send you the letter Cynthia: we have lots of students today! some beginners and some from the ongoing class too Barbara M: Hi Mimi. I think you're right on time. :) AKTATTER: any time is a good time picotsnkeys: Hi Sue and Cynthia and all. If I'm quiet, the computer froze :) Elipand: k TN joined the chat 27 hours ago Brenda: Hi Mime Mimi: What a large group? Surely not all newbies? da tatter: cisco007@swbell.net I may have used a different name when I signed up, sorry Mimi: Brenda, are you the UK Brenda? Shanan: I'm wondering if I can take the laptop w me to town and tat while I am sitting in line to pick up the nephews. As long as I don't type/tat/drive all at once I should be good, right? Cynthia: shall I send you some warm to help keep it unfrozen...lol Brenda: Yes. Brenda: nice of you to remember AKTATTER: oh that is ok, I just want to make sure you get the info, da Barbara M: warm is always good! Mimi: Driving and cluny: I taught a friend to make the cluny loom, and at every stop light on the way home picotsnkeys: it has been cold this summer. No tomatoes to speak of :( Mimi: She practiced the loom movements. Gina: its been really really hot here this summer Mimi: She got a lot of looks from neighboring motorists! sunela: Georgia was there any specific practice lesson for today that I missed? picotsnkeys: Mimi, I love it! Paige joined the chat 27 hours ago Shanan: lol Gina: I have the plastic canvas star to make the cluny loom but I haven't tried to make it yet Mimi: Not sure why you're here Brenda, you're already a champ cluny maker. Maybe you can teach instead! Leticia: I don't think I have the pattern either ... I'm kind of confused Shanan: I bet she did Mimi Judy joined the chat 27 hours ago Brenda: what a way to learn the loom mjb: m Paige: I don't have a pattern either ^^ and sorry, my 50 some web pages open kind of all went boom. Cynthia: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/mimi/kitescmr.html here is the link for the lesson Mimi: Melanie picked up the cluny really quickly. stitchingsharon: I have the plastic canvas starts, shuttles loaded with size 10 thread -- some stuff printed -- I am ready! Brenda: wouldn't miss it for anything. one of my favorites. along with the SCMR Mimi: In fact, she was doing hanging clunies before anyone else I know Judy: Aiee, wandering in cyberspace I fell off. How is this going to go? Mimi: she invented them herself AKTATTER: Cynthia kept the pattern secret today so the intrigue would get you into class Leticia Brenda: thanks Mimi. but no thanks. I will try and help. lol Shanan: I love hanging clunies!! Cynthia: the star loom is here: http://www.georgiaseitz.com/2003/patclunyloom.html Shanan: Really?! AKTATTER: Brenda hung her clunies?? Boy, I've felt like doing that a time or two before Barbara M: what loom & star are you all talking about?Is there some place where I could find the info? Shanan: lol Barbara M: Oh, thank you. Shanan: I just finished up a cluny heart now I am trying to figure out how I made it, lol Cynthia: I type slow so have it on a doc and just cl;ick and move.... Elipand: k Mimi: Here is some of Melanie's work with what we called split clunies at the time (now more popularly called hanging) Mimi: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/mimi/violets.htm Bernice joined the chat 27 hours ago arigamor joined the chat 27 hours ago Mimi: That is NOT today's lesson - something to strive for. Shanan: I have to hide the ends still, but I can put up a pic in nsan arigamor: Hi everybody. Sorry I´m late Mimi: Good job Shanan! Instinctive tatting is good! Cynthia: Tatman has listed a bunch of picts for us to drool over and stive to do eventually! Brenda: looked at that site many a time. with envy Cynthia: I can get the list off nsan if we need it Shanan: I love that flower! AKTATTER: wb bernice and aurora Cynthia: Mark is incredibly generous with his patterns Mimi: The purple flowers are very attractive in person - 3-d effect really Shanan: Mark is awesome! Hope to see him again in Oct! Mimi: The flower itself is not difficult at all. Barbara M: Should we be winding our shuttles yet? Alizandria joined the chat 27 hours ago Shanan: so many patterns so little time! Cynthia: Shall we get started with the Super September Special Event? Please sign in and I'll introduce our awesome teacher for the day picotsnkeys: k TN: k Shanan: Shanan Strode Charleston, IL USA Shanans3bs@yahoo.com Gina: I'm afraid I'm not prepared at all but I'll at least have the lesson for later Cynthia: to sign in--name, location, email, shuttle or needle AKTATTER: AKTATTER@aol.com Georgia Seitz Greenup Illinois USA Brenda: Brenda Evans toffee_apple55@tiscali.c​o.uk shuttle England Shanan: Shanan Strode Charleston, IL USA Shanans3bs@yahoo.com shuttle Gina: Gina Shillitani, Tampa, FL USA deastrega@yahoo.com shuttle skfuller: Sue K Fuller Loveland C Mimi: Mimi Dillman, Everett WA USA, ntrop@ix.netcom.com shuttle mostly some needle Alizandria: Hi everyone...i'm here but not here...will be watching now and participating this evening. :) Cynthia: Cynthia Stevenson, Stillwater OK USA, brasthatfit@yahoo.com arigamor: Ari, Valencia-Spain, arigamor@hotmail.com shuttle picotsnkeys: Melanie Cervi aka picotsnkeys @ yahoo.com in Los Gatos, CA USA skfuller: CO rlskfuller@comcast.net Barbara M: Barbara Muehl, Sequim Washington. barken4 @ hotmail.com Shuttle stitchingsharon joined the chat 27 hours ago AKTATTER: wb sharon TN: Terry Nimmer; Madison WI; nimmer@mac.com; shuttle Paige: Paige Kernersville, North Carolina crasshtesst@yahoo.com shuttle Elipand: Elipand,TN,elipand@gmail​.com Judy: Judy Anderson, Montrose CA USA, andersonjudith@att.net needle mjb: Mary Jane Brittingham., Santa Claus., Indiana usa stitchingsharon: Sharon Fawns Kentucky USA stitchingsharon@hughes.n​et shuttle tatter Cynthia: our awesome guest teacher is Mimi Dillman...Mimi please go to all caps for us linda: Linda Harrington, l_m_harrington@yahoo.com​, Largo, MD Leticia: Leticia Bair, Tigard, OR, shuttle probably (still learning needle) Gina: welcome Mimi :) Mimi: CYNTHIA WON'T LET ME HIDE Jenny joined the chat 27 hours ago Leticia: oops ... forgot the email -- leticia.bair@verizon.net​ arigamor: It´s a pleasure MIMI AKTATTER: welcome jenny Cynthia: welcome Terry! and all the other beginners who are maiing their first appearance sunela: Sunela Thomas, Stewartsville, NJ sunela@yahoo.com, shuttle Barbara M: Thank you so much, Mimi & Cynthia. Jenny: Hi sorry I'm late TN: Thanks Cynthia: the floor is yours Mimi Bernice: Bernice Odom Full time in motorhome. Right now in Des Moines, WA at our son's. bmo1941@gmail.com....nee​dle Brenda: k Mimi: I HAVE PHOTO INSTRUCTIONS ON MY WEBSITE: Mimi: SHUTTLE AS THE TOOL: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instruct.htm Mimi joined the chat 27 hours ago Mimi: SORRY CHANGING WINDOWS CLOSED ONE! jeanne: Thanks for the photos! that helps. :) Mimi: NEEDLE AS THE TOOL: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instructneedle.htm CelticDreamWeaver joined the chat 27 hours ago Mimi: THE INITIAL PHOTOS WERE ACTUALLY DONE BY A JAPANESE TATTER Mimi: THE STORY IS AT THE END OF THE SHUTTLE TATTING INSTRUCTIONS CelticDreamWeaver: HIya everybody Bernice joined the chat 27 hours ago Mimi: I HOPE THEY HELP YOU, TOO. Mimi: IN ANY CASE, WHAT WE TATTERS CALL "CLUNIES" ARE WOVEN LEAVES THAT HAVE APPEARED Mimi: IN LACES FOR QUITE A LONG TIME Mimi: NEEDLE LACERS DID THEM FIRST, AKTATTER: hello Sherry skfuller: Hi Sherrie Elipand: k Mimi: THEN BOBBIN LACEMAKERS FIGURED OUT HOW TO MAKE THEM CelticDreamWeaver: hi...hi...hi Mimi: WHAT ISN'T ENTIRELY CLEAR TO ME Mimi: IS WHEN CROCHETERS AND TATTERS FIGURED OUT HOW TO DO IT Cynthia: here's a good link for the needle tatters and can help shuttle users too http://needledreams.tripod.com/clunnyleaves/id6.html Mimi: BUT THEY MIMIC THOSE, TOO CelticDreamWeaver: wow there is 27 of us here this afternoon skfuller: Sorry SherrY CelticDreamWeaver: will this class be given again AKTATTER: super! Mimi: YES SHERRY TONIGHT 9 PM NY TIME AKTATTER: 9pm tonight Mimi: WHAT I DO KNOW IS Mimi: THE EARLIEST CLUNY INSTRUCTIONS AND PATTERN IN TATING THAT I HAVE SEEN Mimi: DATES TO THE EARLY 1900'S, SOMEWHERE IN THE TEENS I THINK Mimi: IF ANYONE KNOWS OF EARLIER, I'D LOVE TO HEAR. Mimi: ANYHOW, I LEARNED TO MAKE THEM FROM MONICA HAHN AKTATTER: It would be great if we could document the earlies known tatting pattern with tatted clunies Mimi: THE ONE WHO PUBLISHED THE TATTED ANGELS AND CHRISTMAS PATTERNS THAT A LOT OF YOU HAVE (DOVER BOOK) Shanan: I have to run and get children, but will be here for the later class tonight. CelticDreamWeaver: Heya SKFULLER....when are you going to send me that angel pattern to proof? Jenny: k AKTATTER: see ya shanan Mimi: WE WERE BLESSED OT HAEV HER HERE WITH US IN THE PUGET SOUND AREA Mimi: HER METHOD WAS THE FIRST ONE I DID SUCCESSFULLY BECAUSE OF ONE LITTLE CHANGE Shanan: bye G Mimi: I'LL POINT THAT OUT WHEN WE GET TO IT AKTATTER: k Mimi: IN ANY CASE, TO MAKE THE LEAVES, THERE ARE 3 BASIC STEPS Mimi: 1. MAKE A LOOM TO WEAVE ON skfuller: Hopefuly Very very soon Mimi: 2. WEAVE THE LEAF Elipand: k arigamor: . CelticDreamWeaver: can you email me the rough draft? Mimi: 3. GET RID OF THE LOOM LOOPS, LEAVING ONLY THE LEAF Mimi: IT'S MAGIC :0 picotsnkeys: k Mimi: ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THE LEAVES SO FAR? Paige: k Mimi: EVERYONE GOT THE LINKS TO PHOTO INSTRUCTIONS THEY NEED? Cynthia: but we can all make it happen! Alizandria: k Brenda: magic it sure is TN: k Gina: looks like magic skfuller: Yes please give me your address again CelticDreamWeaver: celticdreamweave@yahoo.c​om Mimi: FIRST OFF, PLEASE REMEMBER THAT THE WAY I MAKE THESE, IT CAN BE DONE WITH A NEEDLE OR A SHUTTLE Mimi: THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS THE IMPLEMENT THAT CARRIES THE THREAD WHEN YOU WEAVE Mimi: THE MOTIONS ARE ALL THE SAY Mimi: SAME Mimi: SO I'LL SAY "TOOL" OR "IMPLEMENT" MEANING SHUTTLE OR NEEDLE Mimi: FIRST STEP: MAKING THE LOOM Jenny: k Mimi: YOU WILL HOLD THE WORK IN YOUR PINCH WHERE YOU NORMALLY WOULD FOR MAKING A FOLLOWING RING OR CHAIN Bernice: k Mimi: IF YOU ARE STARTING WITH 2 TOOLS CTM OR TOOL-AND-BALL, MAKE A KNOT OR QUICK RING TO HOLD ONTO Mimi: AND WORK THE LEAF AGAINST IT Mimi: THE LOOM WILL BE MADE WTIH THE BALL THREAD OR SHUTTLE 2 AKTATTER: just fyi the loom can be made with the hand, with the plastic loom or plastic star or using the arm of a chair and pins like Edwige Renaudin http://www.georgiaseitz.com/2007/edwigerenaudincluny.jpg Mimi: RIGHT, BUT MAY I TALK HAND? IT'S MY MOST FAMILIAR METHOD AKTATTER: hand came first! Brenda: I prefer hand Mimi: WE CAN READ OVER THE OTHERS - THEY WILL LOOK VERY FAMILIAR AFTER SEEING LOOMING THE HAND Elipand: k Mimi: I ALSO NEED TO STOP AND TALK FINGERS. Cynthia: here are good pictures of the hand method http://needledreams.tripod.com/clunnyleave Mimi: I WILL REFER TO THE PINCH = THUMB AND FOREFINGER Mimi: 3RD FINGER = MIDDLE FINGER Mimi: 4TH FINGER = RING FINGER, Gina: I got that page not found, Cynthia Mimi: PINKY = 5TH OR SMALLEST FINGER Mimi: TO START THE LOOM, TAKE THE BALL THREAD FROM THE PINCH UPWARDS BEHIND THE 3RD AND 4TH FINGERS Mimi: THEN BACK TO THE PINCH ***OVER THE TOP OF THE FOREFINGER INTO THE PINCH*** Mimi: DIRECTION NIS IMPORTANT Cynthia: hmm I just clicked on it from my notes and got it...here is from online http://needledreams.tripod.com/clunnyleaves/id6.html Jenny: k Mimi: SO THAT THE BALL THREAD IS HEADING DOWN TOWARD YOUR LAP Mimi: OK SO FARA Gina: now I got it, must have been a fluke Mimi: NEXT GUIDE THE BALL THREAD BETWEEN THE 4TH AND 5TH FINGERS AND BACK TO THE PINCH Mimi: APPROACHING THE PINCH FROM UP FROM YOUR LAP AND UPWARD TOWARD YOUR FINGERS AKTATTER: k mjb: m Mimi: THIS 2ND LOOP IS BASICALLY A LOOP AROUND YOUR PINKY FROM UNDER YOUR PINCH Mimi: LAST, GUIDE THE BALL THREAD GOING UP FROM THE PINCH TO BETWEEN THE 3RD AND 4TH FINGERS, Mimi: AND THEN TIE IT OFF ON THE 5TH FINGER Mimi: YOU WILL SEE THAT YOU HAVE 3 THREADS PLUS A PINKY LOOP Mimi: SORRY, 3 VERTICAL THREADS AND THE PINKY LOOP Mimi: IGNORE THE PINKY LOOP Mimi: HTIS IS THE HANDY BIT THAT MONA TAUGHT ME. KEEPING THAT LOOP THERE WILL HELP LATER BELIEVE ME Mimi: THE IMPORTANT PART WILL BE THE 3 VERTICAL THREADS THAT GO BETWEEN THE PINCH AND YOUR 3RD AND 4TH FINGERS Elipand: k Mimi: EVERYONE HAVE THEIR HAND "LOOMED" UP? Brenda: k arigamor: . sunela: yes.. Paige: yes Cynthia: yes Jenny: Jes Brenda: yes arigamor: yes Gina: I get the idea skfuller: Yes Mimi: OK THEN DROP IT OFF AND FLEX YOUR FINGERS, ALLOWING THE CIRCULATION TO RETURN (END OF YOUR PINKY IS PROBABLY PURPLE BY NOW) picotsnkeys: just watching for now AKTATTER: << got a good grip so far Bernice: just watching today AKTATTER: whew!! Mimi: I KNOW THIS SEEMS SILLY TO DROP IT, BUT THE WEAVING TAKES SOME TIME Cynthia: lol starting over! Mimi: YOU'LL NEED PRACTICE LOOMING, TOO sunela: really...I need to drop off the looms? Mimi: SO IT'S BEST TO START OVER AGAIN BEFORE TRYING TO WEAVE Mimi: I DON'T WANT ANYONE LOSING ANY FINGERS! Mimi: SERIOUSLY SUNELA Gina: you drop the whole loom or just the pinky? Mimi: I RECOMMEND EVERYTHING Elipand: k Gina: ok Mimi: START WITH UNDOING THE PINKY OF COURSE sunela: ok...if you say so. Mimi: SHAKE THOSE HANDS BELOW YOUR WAIST! Mimi: SUNELA, GEORGIA CALLS IT DEATH GRIP TATITNG FOR A REASON :) Mimi: FIRST FEW TIMES UNTIL YOU BUILD UP SOME WEAVING SPEED, IT CAN GET A BIT PAINFUL Mimi: SO DO THE LOOM AGAIN Brenda: it is true. Mimi: PINCH THE WORK Mimi: BALL THREAD UP FROM PINCH BEHIND 3&4 AKTATTER: I must learn to relax my hand when holding the loom threads in place TN: k Mimi: EXACTLY GEORGIA, BUT WITH SO MANY THINGS GOING ON, RELAXING IS THE LAST TO BE REMEMBERED :) Mimi: BALL THREAD TOP TO BOTTOM OF PINCH Mimi: BALL THREAD FROM BOTTOM OF PINCH BETWEEN 4&5 Mimi: BEHIND 5 AND BACK TO PINCH FROM BELOW Mimi: BALL THREAD FROM PINCH UPWARD TO BETWEEN 3&4 Mimi: TIE OFF ON 5 Mimi: THEN YOU'RE READY TO PICK UP YOUR IMPLEMENT TO WEAVE! Mimi: THE WEAVING IS PROBABLY BEST SEEN IN TEHP HOTOS Gina: how do you tie off? Mimi: IT'S THE SAME AS THOSE USING OTHER WEAVING LOOMS DO Mimi: WRAP THE THREAD AROUND YOUR PINKY SEVERAL TIMES GINA Gina: ok skfuller: k Mimi: THAT WILL HELP HOLD THE TENSION ON THE MIDDLE THREAD OF THE LOOM picotsnkeys: k Mimi: THE WEAVING MOTION IS UNDER OVER UNDER Brenda: http://mordueparladentelle.wordpress.com/2009/04/03/cluny-tallies-the-start-finish/ Mimi: THEN ON THE RETURN, THE OPPOSITE: OVER UNDER OVER Jenny: k Mimi: YOU HAVE TO DO THE OPPOSITE EACH TIME Mimi: OR THE WEAVING COMES UNDONE Mimi: THE WEAVING IS DONE WITH YOUR ORIGINAL SHUTTLE 1 OR NEEDLE 1 Mimi: BECAUSE I'M RIGHT HANDED I LIKE TO START WAEAVING RIGHT TO LEFT Alizandria: k Bernice: k Mimi: SO i TAKE MY TOOL UNDER THE THREAD THAT GOES PINCH TO OUTSIDE OF FINGER 4 Mimi: OVER THE MIDDLE THREAD(IT GOES FROM PINCH TO BETWEEN 3 & 4) Mimi: AND THEN BACK UNDER THE THREAD FROM PINCH TO OUTSIDE FINGER 3 Mimi: THEN I PULL THE THREAD THROUGH UNTIL THE LOOP ON THE RIGHT SIDE IS PULLED ALL THE WAY IN Mimi: NEXT I WEAEV BACK Elipand: k Cynthia: k Mimi: BUT THIS TIME I JUST TAKE THE TOOL UNDER THE MIDDLE THREAD (THE ONE FROM PINCH TO BETWEEN FINGER 3 & 4) Mimi: AND PULL THROUGH Mimi: THAT FORMS THE OVER-UNDER-OVER NEEDED AKTATTER: k dagmar joined the chat 27 hours ago Mimi: THAT MAKES ONE WEAVE COMPLETED. Mimi: KEEP WEAVING THE LEAF, DOING ANOTHER 9 SUCH WEAVES Mimi: MOST LEAVES ARE DONE GETTING WIDER TO THE MIDDLE, THEN NARROWER TO THE TOP Paige: k AKTATTER: welcome dagmar Mimi: THE SHAPING IS DONE AS YOU WEAVE Jenny: k Mimi: YOU HAVE TO SHAPE EACH TIME YOU PASS THE TOOL Mimi: YOU CAN SOMETIMES CHANGE THE SHAPE A BIT ONCE YOU'VE FINISHED THAT WEAVE, BUT IT IS DIFFICULT Mimi: SO I BASICALLY SAY: DON'T PASS THE TOOL AGAIN UNTIL YOU HAVE THE WEAVE THE WAY YOU LIKE AKTATTER: dagmar is Ivone with you? Mimi: I WOULD ASK A QUESTION NOW BUT WHO HAS FINGERS TO TYPE :) Mimi: SORRY dagmar: vou bem Georgia. e voc ê. Não tenho muita habilidade com o chat Georgia going well. and youre. I'm not very skilled with the chat AKTATTER: lol my right hand is free but the left is all tied up Mimi: PLEASE LET ME KNOW WHEN YOU'RE FINISHED WEAVING AND READY TO MAKE THE LOOM GO AWAY AKTATTER: that is ok dagmar we discuss the cluny tatting AKTATTER: the pattern for later http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/mimi/kitescmr.html Mimi: INSTRUCTIONS IN ENGLISH AGAIN, WITH PHOTOS: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instruct.htm sunela: ok...i am ready. but, my cluny is looking little whimpy Mimi: BUT THE PHOTOS TELL THE STORY. I HAVE HEARD FROM NON-NATIVE SPEAKERS WHO LEARNED JUST USING PHOTOS AKTATTER joined the chat 27 hours ago AKTATTER: the instructions http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instruct.htm Mimi: MY FIRST FEW LEAVES WERE ... UM... LESS THAN PLEASING TO ME IN SHAPE TOO Mimi: STUDENTS HAVE CALLED THEIRS ANYTHING FROM "SQUASHED BUGS" TO OTHER LESS COMPLIMENTARY THINGS Brenda: and me. still are sometimes Mimi: WE'RE JUST WORRIED ABOUT THE MECHANICS FOR NOW Mimi: COSMETICS WE'LL WORK ON LATER skfuller: gotta go get my reading glasses Mimi: NICE SHAPING TAKES PRACTICE Jenny: ready Mimi: WHEN FINISHED WEAVING, IT'S TIME TO (HOORAY) TAKE THE LOOM OFF YOUR FINGERS Mimi: CAREFULLY UNWIND THE BALL THRAED OFF YOUR PINKY AKTATTER: my first clunies were awful too . they are in white, I used a loom for the green ones which were a little better dagmar: ivone não está comigo ivone not with me O Cynthia: but there is hope for all us us! mine is not ready to show but I may just to show who bad it is... Mimi: PINCH THE LEAF AKTATTER: am imporved since then AKTATTER: http://www.georgiaseitz.com/classes2001/cluny/gsfirstcluny.jpg Mimi: AND ALLOW THE LOOPS TO DROP FROM YOUR 3/4 FINGERS AND PINKY AKTATTER: ok dagmar sorry Ivone did not come but glad you are here :) Mimi: FLEX THE LOOM HAND!! TN: all set, glad there's no web cam here :-) Mimi: GET SOME CIRCULATION BACK!! Mimi: HOPEFULLY THE PINKY IS ONLY PURPLE AND NOT BLACK:) AKTATTER: whew at last my hand was practically shaking Brenda: lol Mimi Mimi: FIRST PLACE THE SHUTTLE/NEEDLE OFF TO THE SIDE AWAY FROM THE LEAF arigamor: Left hand? where´s it? lololol can´t feel my hand Mimi: MAKE SURE YOU KNOW WHICH THREAD THAT IS Mimi: IT IS VERY IMPORTANT NOT TO TOUCH THAT THREAD UNTIL AFTER THE LOOM HAS BEEN PULLED IN AKTATTER: I know that feeling.. hmm or lack thereof LOL dagmar: Ivone not live near me AKTATTER: too bad Dagmar but glad you are here Mimi: REALLY, YOU DON'T LOSE YOUR LEFT HAND DOING CLUNIES ONCE YOU HAVE THE TECHNIQUE - IT'S ONLY AT THE BEGINNING ============================================================ Created at Chatzy.com The Online Tatting Class http://www.chatzy.com/695768390662 Visible contents as of 10 Sep 2010 17:41 UTC-05:00 (217 KB) Page 2 of 5 · Char 51236 to 102445 · Newest posts at the bottom ============================================================ Mimi: OK EVERYONE KNOW WHERE THEIR SHUTTLE/NEEDLE IS? Brenda: k Jenny: k mjb: n TN: k Mimi: WHAT WE WILL DO TO MAKE THE LOOPS GO AWAY IS PULL THREADS IN A CERTAIN ORDER Mimi: I RECOMMEND KEEPING THE 3/4 FINGERS IN THAT TOP LOOP AKTATTER sent out an invitation 26 hours ago linda: k Mimi: BEFORE STARTING TO PULL FIRST Mimi: THE FIRST PULL: BOTTOM LOOP (THE ONE THAT WAS AROUND YOUR PINKY, THE "MONA" LOOP) Mimi: WATCH WHEN YOU PULL AKTATTER: k Mimi: PULL THE SIDE THAT MAKES THE LOOP ON YOUR 3/4 FINGERS GET SMALLER Mimi: THE FINGERS ARE IN THAT TOP LOOP Mimi: TO KEEP IT FROM TWISTING UP Mimi: JUST LIKE CLOSING A RING, dagmar: Georgia I got to see the link to follow the lesson. I do not know how these lessons online Mimi: YOU DONT' WANT YOUR THREAD TO TWIST ON THE WAY IN Mimi: IT'S A BEAR TO UNTWIST (DON'T ASK ME HOW I KNOW) stitchingsharon: I need 3 hands Mimi: I THINK THAT'S WHY EDWIGE PINNED IT ALL TO HER EASY CHAIR ARM!! Mimi: HAS EVERYONE PULLED THE TUP LOOP IN? Mimi: TOP LOOP Paige: yes TN: done it Jenny: yes Mimi: NEXT STEP: PULL IN THE BOTTOM LOOP **** BY PULLING THE BALL THREAD/SHUTTLE 2**** Mimi: IMPORTANT: BALL THREAD/SHUTTLE 2 skfuller: k Bernice: k Mimi: GET A FINGER IN THAT BIG LOOP Mimi: IT WILLWANT TO TWIST, TOO, BECAUSE IT'S SO LONG AKTATTER: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instruct.htm instruções e fotos Mimi: WHEN THAT LOOP DISAPPEARS, Mimi: VOILA, YOU ARE DONE! AKTATTER: padrão para a prática de Cluny tarde http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/mimi/kitescmr.html Mimi: YOU HAVE A LEAF WITH YOUR PREVIOUS WORK (KNOT) BELOW Mimi: AND 2 THREADS COMING FROM THE TOP Mimi: SO IT FUNCTIONS KIND OF LIKE A CHAIN OR SPLIT RING Mimi: YOU CAN MAKE LOTS OF THESE ONE AFTER THE OTHER AKTATTER: my loop always twists thought that was normal? Mimi: SUCH AS IN TODAY'S LESSON PATTERN: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/mimi/kitescmr.html Mimi: TWISTING IS NORMAL, GEORGIA - KEEPING A FINGER IN THE LOOP AS IT GETS SMALLER IS HOW I TAME IT Mimi: OTHERS MAY HAVE OTHER MEANS OF COPING picotsnkeys: how many passes for a "leaf" for this tail? Elipand: k Brenda: me too Mimi: REMEMBER, GEORGIA, I'VE MADE OVER 100 LEAVES WITH LBH Mimi: I KNOW TWIST AKTATTER: thanks for that tip mimi it may make all the difference to me next time Mimi: LOL sunela: is there a rule of how many passes to make a leaf (normal looking one) AKTATTER: oh my that thread twisted so bad!!! Judy: Seems to me that whether you pin it to a chair or use your hand depends on how many you're going to be doing. dagmar: The pattern is lovely Mimi Mimi: PASSES TO MAKE A LEAF DEPENDS ON TEH PATTERN Mimi: I'VE SEEN ANYWHERE FROM 8 OR 9 UP TO OVER 30 DEPENDING ON THE LENGTH NEEDED Mimi: MOST 20TH CENTURY PATTERNS, THOU8GH, TEND TO BE 10-12. MARK MYERS USED 15 IN ONE OF HIS ANGELS AND REALLY SCREWED ME UP WHEN I WAS TEST TATTING LOL Rosemarie joined the chat 26 hours ago Mimi: I HAD TO TAKE OUT THE LEAF AND START OVER, BUT THE RESULT WAS WORTH IT picotsnkeys: then if I practice with 10-15 passes, I should get the hang of an average size element. Rosemarie: Hi All sorry I'm so late. I'll have to sit in on tonight's class. Mimi: ANYHOW, THE PREMIER CLUNY TATTER IN FRANCE, "ELISADUSUD" USES CLOSER TO 20 - HERS PROPORTIONALLY ARE LONGER THAN MOST AKTATTER: I'd bet this leaf Mark did had at least 30 passes in it http://www.tat-man.net/tatterville/tatgallery/BL_Tat_motifs/cluny-leaf.jpg AKTATTER: welcome Rosemarie arigamor: Mine isn´t a leaf and is separetaed from the initial ring :( AKTATTER: oh that happened to me too Aurora Mimi: YES GEORGIA - DID YOU NOTICE FOR EFFECT SOME WERE LONGER THAN OTEHRS? AKTATTER: but the next one willbe better Rosemarie: The link to the lesson/pattern come up broken. How can I get the lesson? Mimi: RIGHT AURORA. NOW THAT YOU KNOW WHAT YOU NEED TO ACCOMPLISH, YOU WILL DO YOUR FIRST WEAVE AKTATTER: yes the side leaves seemed tighter and shorter to me Mimi: CLOSER TO THE PREVIOUS WORK. arigamor: Thanks Georgia, but I cant see how to keep them together AKTATTER: here aer the photos andhow to Rosemarie http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instruct.htm Mimi: THAT'S THE WAY TO AVOID THE GAPSOSIS - DO NOT START ANY WEAVES PAST THE FIRST ONE UNTIL YOU CAN SEE YOU ARE WEAVING NEXT TO THE PREVIOUS ELEMENT Mimi: GAPSOSIS IS THE MAIN DIFFICULTY WHEN USING A LOOM RATHER THAN THE HAND stitchingsharon: I did it!! A little lopsided, but I did it! Mimi: YAY SHARON! stitchingsharon: Cheap thread kept stretching AKTATTER: this is the practice pattern Rosemarie http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/mimi/kitescmr.html Mimi: WITH LOOMS I MODIFY THE INSTRUCTIONS TO MAKE SURE THAT YOUR WORK IS ON *TOP* OF THE LOOM AKTATTER: wtg sharon dagmar joined the chat 26 hours ago Mimi: F YOU KEEP IT BELOW THE LOOM, HOW CAN YOU MAKE SURE TO START WEAVING NEXT TO IT? Elipand: k Brenda: nice work sharon Rosemarie: Thank you AKTATTER: wb dagmar wb = Bem-vindo de volta Mimi: LOOMS ARE GREAT ONCE YOU LEARN WHAT YOU NEED TO DO WITH YOURS TO AVOID GAPSOSIS Cynthia: Yay sharon! Mimi: IT'S GETTING CLOSE TO THE END OF MY LUNCH HOUR dagmar: Georgia, have to leave the chat. Send me an email when you can. Mimi: SO I HAD BETTER GIVE A QUICK PRECIS ON THE PATTERN stitchingsharon: No kloops in the pinch? loop around pinkie becomes bottom loop to tighten? Mimi: I KNOW CYNTHIA CAN EXPLAIN TEH SCMR'S picotsnkeys: hhmmmm....I still have gapsosis with rings and chains when I'm not paying close attention! lol Cynthia: I have a knot...trying again....see even I have to learn this one! Mimi: SO I'LL START EXACTLY SHARON Mimi: SORRY - SHARON YOU ARE CORRECT Mimi: THE PATTERN STARTS AT THE BOTTOM OF THE TAIL AKTATTER: ok I will I am still behind in email after my trip ok eu ainda estou atrás de e-mail após minha viagem Mimi: THE KITE'S TAIL IS INTENDED TO LOOK AS IF IT IS A RIBBON RIPPLING IN THE BREEZE Mimi: SO THE LEAVES SHOULD BE DIFFERENT SIZES AND SHAPES dagmar: k. Hug Judy: checking out bye, Thanks Mimi. AKTATTER: bye AKTATTER: bye Judy Mimi: I THOUGHT THAT WAS GOOD FOR BEGINNERS DUE TO THE DIFFICULTY OF KEEPING THEM THE SAME SIZE skfuller: Thanks Mimi AKTATTER: excellent idea sunela: Thanks Mimi.....see you in the later class. Barbara M: I'm so sorry but I must leave. Thank you all so much. Mimi: YOU START WITH 2 THREADS TIED TOGETHER. FOR SHUTTLE TATTERS I RECOMMEND 2 SHUTTLES Mimi: WEAVE LEAVES AS LONG AS YOU WANT THE TAIL TO BE Brenda: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2wa4n_fin-du-point-d-esprit_creation picotsnkeys: how many threads come out of the top of each leaf? Mimi: THEN TRANSITION TO THE KITE PART WITH A SPLIT RING Mimi: 2 PICOTS Mimi: 2 THREADS THAT IS :) picotsnkeys: ah!thanks Jenny: Thanks Mimi, bye TN: Thanks Mimi - very clear explanation Mimi: ONE IS THE "TOOL" THREAD AN ONE IS THE BALL/SHUTTLE 2 Mimi: EVEYRONE IS WELCOME Jenny left the chat 26 hours ago Mimi: I HOPE YOU TRY A FEW LEAVES BEFORE WRITING THEM OFF Bernice: thanks Gina: thank you Mimi, sorry for so many questions Mimi: THEY ARE A PRETTY ADDITION TO TATTING AKTATTER: I adore the cluny leaves sunela left the chat 26 hours ago Mimi: AND KEEP AWAY THE POSSIBILITY OF BOREDOM WITH RIGNS AND CHAINS picotsnkeys: I can see them as a tail for a bookmark Mimi: MAKES A WONDERFUL BOOKMARK TAIL Mimi: I LIKE IN MY BOOKMARK TAILS TO ALTERNATE THEM WITH SPLIT RINGS Brenda: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2w9sj_frivolite-le-point-desprit-premiere_creation Mimi: I CAN TAKE A QUESTION OR TWO BEFORE I LOG OUT... linda: k Gina: is it easier with the plastic loom Gina: ? Mimi: GINA, I FIND MY HAND EASIER BECAUSE I FEEL PAIN WHEN I PINCH THE LOOM FOR VERY LONG Brenda: Thanks Mimi. If I get stuck with the pattern I will be in touch. Gina: oh okay Mimi: BUT OTHERS FIND THE LOOM EASIER (ONCE THEY FIGUREO UT THE GAPSOSIS AVOIDANCE) Mimi: IT'S PURELY A PERSONAL CHOICE Mimi: TRY BOTH AND SEE WHAT YOU THINK Gina: okay Mimi: YOU CAN MAKE A LOOM FROM CARDBOARD IF YOU NEED TO, OR QUILTERS TEMPLATE IF YOU HAVE IT stitchingsharon: the shape of the weaving determines shape of leaf? Elipand: k Brenda: I prefer hand. feels like you are tatting Mimi: YES SHARON AKTATTER: brenda that is a good video Brenda: what I learnt from Gina: I have the plastic canvas star already Mimi: IF THOSE ARE ELISA'S VIDEOS, THERE WILL BE A SLIGHT DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HOW SHE MAKES HER LOOM AND HOW I JUST TAUGHT IT picotsnkeys: I do like the video Mimi: WEAVING / CLOSING IS SAME Brenda: with the help from Mimi arigamor: Thanks Mimi. I´ll keep trying till comes out Mimi: OK THEN THANKS EVERYONE FOR COMING Mimi: SUCH A LARGE TURNOUT, I'M SO PLEASED Gina: thank you Mimi :) Mimi: I HAD NO CLUE SO MANY WANTED CLUNY LESSONS Brenda: I think one of them is what you sent me Mimi. not sure though AKTATTER: if you want the leaf to be a particular shape, take a sticky note and turn it over, draw the shape of the leaf, then stick the note to the back of the loom or the inside of your hand and use it as a reference for the width and number of passes needed AKTATTER: thanks a bunch mimi Mimi: GOOD IDEA GEORGIA! picotsnkeys: thank you Mimi Cynthia: Thank you Mimi! stitchingsharon: thank you soooo much Mimi Mimi: SEE YOU TONITE CYNTHIA AND GEORGIA (AND RETURNING STUDENTS) HAVE FUN THIS AFTERNOON WEAVING vingerhoedjes joined the chat 26 hours ago Cynthia: With a bit more practice my clunys will look like clunys AKTATTER: see you all tonight vingerhoedjes: hello everione, AKTATTER left the chat 26 hours ago Elipand: thanks,bye vingerhoedjes: a well i am to late Cynthia: Hi vinger Brenda: Thanks for the lesson Mimi Cynthia: I'm still here Brenda: Bye everyone vingerhoedjes: hello brenda vingerhoedjes: and cinthia Brenda: hello vingerhoedjes: lost track of time arigamor: Bye Brenda take care, be happy vingerhoedjes: i am on the camping Brenda: thanks same to all Cynthia: Where are you located--country or continent? vingerhoedjes: i live in the netherlands jamlover joined the chat 26 hours ago vingerhoedjes: and you? Cynthia: USA--Oklahoma I was trying to see if you could make the evening class picotsnkeys: I've been asked to create a bookmark for a hospital chaplain to give out instead of prayer shawls. I think clunys will be a part of them! jamlover: guess I missed out. It said three o'clock and that's what it is right now!! vingerhoedjes: woh thats great picotsnkeys: where are you jamlover? vingerhoedjes: woh i think that is in the middle of the night i think vingerhoedjes: woh i think that is in the middle of the night i think Cynthia: Jam lover where are you? the times are all listed as new york or eastern time in the USA Gina: its 3:00 EST when the class starts vingerhoedjes: no i cant. sorry jamlover: I'm in Iowa. vingerhoedjes: i do not think my husband wil likethat hihi Gina: you can come back at 9 pm EST jamlover Rosemarie joined the chat 26 hours ago Cynthia: yes it is...I'll post the log and so will Georgia tonight after the evening class. I understand about that! Gina: which would be 8 pm your time i think Gina: same class is repeated then Rosemarie: Can't stay I'll try to make tonight's class Bye. vingerhoedjes: a well i will reas the log Cynthia: 9 Eastern, 8 Central, 7 Mountain, 6 Pacific, 5 or 5:30 Alaska and Hawaii vingerhoedjes: bye rosemarie Cynthia: I think.... vingerhoedjes: yep TN left the chat 26 hours ago picotsnkeys: Time to get lunch for me. I can't come tonight, but will check the log later vingerhoedjes: it is now ten o clock in the evening vingerhoedjes: me to Cynthia: Are you, vingerhoedjes on nsan? I will post the log there shortly or you can save it jamlover: How do you check the log so to speak? Gina: oh dear vingerhoedjes picotsnkeys left the chat 26 hours ago Cynthia: click on save print and get all the pages vingerhoedjes: ye that is a idea vingerhoedjes: t know? vingerhoedjes: can i do it know? Cynthia: yes you have to do that before you leave stitchingsharon: Woooo Hooo -- this was worth getting up early for! stitchingsharon: It's going to take some practice -- but I can do it!! vingerhoedjes: thank you very much!!!!!!!!!!! Cynthia: way to go sharon! I'm getting it conquered too! vingerhoedjes: i cant print here, but i can save it on my laptop vingerhoedjes: i cant print here, but i can save it on my laptop Cynthia: yes you can save it vingerhoedjes: bye for know, maybe until next time vingerhoedjes: greetings to evrione to night linda: I really enjoyed the class. Bye. Cynthia: If you are not in newshuttlesandneedle stitchingsharon: shaping the leaf and avoiding gaposis are an issue -- but I WILL conquer those issues vingerhoedjes: give aktatter a bigh hugh Cynthia: please send me name, email, location and screen name and I will add you. I'm Cynthia stevenson and the email is brasthatfit@yahoo.com Cynthia: I will next time I see her... vingerhoedjes: thank you Cynthia: newshuttlesandneedles is the beginner group with lots of help available Cynthia: I had to make it members only due to some juvenile hackers who left crude messages...they did not know the difference between tatting and tattooing... skfuller: LOL:)) stitchingsharon: Thanks for a GREAT class!!! I'm no longer afraid of clunies!! stitchingsharon: Hugs to all! Gotta start getting ready for work -- and go see what the UPS man just brought Cynthia: how are you Sue and glad it helped Sharon! I'm going to conquer them yet! skfuller: Mis-started with a ring threads got tangled so I just listened! skfuller: I'm doing well although busier this fall then I expected since I had to pick up one more day at work stitchingsharon: I have LOTS of practicing to do --- but Now I know the basics --- I'll be back in the classrooms as work schedule permits skfuller: At least I still have my Mondays and Thursdays free to come to the online classes Cynthia: glad you could come sharon and I look forward to when we see you in class Cynthia: that does help Sue to be able to do some things for your self Cynthia: How many days do you have/get to work? skfuller: 3 now which means my day to do housework has to be on the weekend yuk Cynthia: I understand how that goes for sure! but maybe someone will help out a bit...to make it easier Cynthia: I will conquer the cluny...I know I can, I know I can... skfuller: Luckily my husband does a very lot around the house so I'm very fortunate skfuller: I'm going to get a cluny string going before class Cynthia: That really helps and you can break laundry into daily batches too...been there done that when I was working 2 jobs and had months of no days off at all skfuller: it's been many uears since I've made 1 Cynthia: don't care to go back to that! skfuller: I had a year like that last year & i hope never again Cynthia: Jan needs the computer for job search so I'd better close for now so she can have it for awhile.... skfuller: OK See you tonight! Cynthia: bye Sue and all....see you later skfuller: Bye everyone skfuller joined the chat 26 hours ago skfuller: Are a lot of you still hear or is my 11 online list wrong? skfuller: still here! skfuller: Hellooooo out there - anybody still here? skfuller: Well, no answers so I'll be leaving CelticDreamWeaver: are you there Sue Joy left this message 25 hours ago: Hello is anony there Joy joined the chat 25 hours ago Joy: is anyone there Joy: Looks like I am too late this morning will try this afternoon Joy joined the chat 25 hours ago arigamor was timed out 24 hours ago Bernice was timed out 24 hours ago Bernice was timed out 24 hours ago Shanan joined the chat 24 hours ago da tatter was timed out 24 hours ago Greengal joined the chat 24 hours ago Nita joined the chat 24 hours ago Joy joined the chat 23 hours ago Joy: UIs anyone there now? Greengal: lying next to computer snoring CelticDreamWeaver was timed out 23 hours ago Joy joined the chat 23 hours ago Joy: I think I missed the whole lesson how do I get a copy please Greengal: There is a lesson coming up. I hoope Joy: I live in Australia so have to get the time right so what time is the next lesson in New York? Greengal: Used my time converter should be at 11 Sydney time will be back then Joy: I have to take my DH to see the Doctor so I will miss is..I live in Melbourne and thought that there would be one at 2 pm Melbourne time? Greengal: Pretty sure I have it correct. Will be a pity if you miss it. ( Kathy in NowraNSW) Joy: If I miss it can I get a copy ? Greengal: Sure . I think if you go to the top of this page you can click the previous content bar Greengal: On the page that opens change 2/2 to page 1/2 and click Shanan: hi guys Greengal: click save print. That will open the ealier part of todays lesson. Greengal: Hi Shanan Shanan: I just got a chance to read through the lesson Shanan: Had to leave just as it was getting good this afternoon Joy: Hi Shanan Joy in Australia here but must go to take ny DH to see the Doctor..been in hospitalfor a errk and 2 days 4 days in Critical care Shanan: oh no! I'm so sorry!!! Shanan: I pray he isw better Greengal: Take care Joy hope he's better soon Shanan: it is always so hard to see your DH in the hospital, been there! mine was in for 4 months and a week of it in Critical care, so I know how it feels. ((hugs)) Shanan: The next class should start in about an hr and 15 minutes I believe. Greengal: Yup sounds right to me. I will keep an eye on the board as I do some stuff here. see u then Shanan: k Wally joined the chat 22 hours ago Wally: Hi! Shanan: Hi Wally! Wally: At what time starts the class? Shanan: I have been pracicing clunies, how bout you Wally? Do you already know how to make clunies? Shanan: in 1 hr Wally: I know how to make them but I need practice. The last time I made something with clunnies was like 2 years ago. :-P Wally: Never have been my favs, even in bobbin lace. Ugh! Shanan: This is my attempt this week at doing clunies http://groups.yahoo.com/group/newshuttlesandneedles/photos/recent/836857834/view Shanan: I can't get the center group to stay together :-( claudia joined the chat 22 hours ago claudia: hi all!! Wally: I can't see the photo because I'm not member of that group. :( Shanan: I love them, they are so pretty, but I just can't get my groups to stay together Shanan: Oh! Sorry Wally! Wally: do you have it on a blog or online album? Shanan: I just uploaded it to the computer so I will go put it on my online album then give you the link! Shanan: brb claudia: hola wally claudia: i dont know there was a class today.. Shanan: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=17357&id=1013837460&l=48e6f5c755 Shanan: that should work Wally, it is the pink and white heart Shanan: It is the very last pic in the album FLTATTER joined the chat 22 hours ago Wally: Oh! That's a pretty heart! Shanan: thanks Shanan: It needs re-worked until I get the pattern just the way I want it though Wally: After the clunny how many stitches you do? Shanan: I am taking the online tatting design class right now, so maybe that will help Wally: Yes, that class helps a lot Wally: I really like how the flowers look Shanan: 3-2 then a ring Shanan: r: 2+2-2-2-2-2-2-2 Wally: May be if you do less they will form a better center Shanan: then back to finish up the chain with 2+3 Shanan: hmmm, that may work Shanan: I think it is more a matter of how I join my clunies to the one before it Greengal: Wish I could get this computer to give a big klaxon hoot to wake me up when class starts Wally: lol, yes, we need alarms and horns Cynthia joined the chat 22 hours ago Wally: Could be also. Shanan: flashing lights would be good too! Cynthia: Hi everyone Wally: Elisa du Sud makes lovely clunies Wally: Hi Cynthia! Shanan: Hi Cynthia Cynthia: I'm trying to catch up with the chat... Wally: I'm trying to catch up with EVERYTHING after spending time in Palmetto. Wally: At least the e-mails are considerable low number now. Cynthia: Wally would you like to be a member of nsan (newshuttlesandneedles)?​ Wally: Sure! FLTATTER joined the chat 22 hours ago Cynthia: For everyone just send me the following info and I can send you an invite: name location email screen name to brasthatfit@yahoo.com and I'll send you an invite. Cynthia: we had it open and had some incredibly juvenile crude messages...I don't think they really wanted tatting on their genitals....I think they were thinking tatooing....also their terminology was...well lets just say I've heard the terms not used in polite company! Shanan: Does anyone know how to keep a center cluster of clunies together? Is their a trick to joining them? Cynthia: good question for Mimi when class gets started. Bill joined the chat 22 hours ago Shanan: k Bill: Good evening everyone! Shanan: Hi Bill! Cynthia: Hi Bill! Bill: Is everyone well? Bill: Am I late? Wally: Hi Bill! Shanan: We are fine here. Nope you are 30 min early Cynthia: I'm well and no you aren't late yet...class starts in about 35 mins according to my clock Bill: I like that though, gives everyone a chance to get the chatting out of the way. Shanan: We had 27 tatters in the early class! Paige joined the chat 22 hours ago Bill: WOW! Paige: Hello all! Shanan: I wonder how many we will have tonight? Bill: Hi Paige! Cynthia: how true we all miss our chats! and getting together weekly... Shanan: Hi Paige Bill: Really, they are still showing up! Shanan: Bill, can you do clunies? Cynthia: Mimi does an awesome job of teaching them Dawn joined the chat 22 hours ago Shanan: I'm sorry I had to leave mid-class this afternoon! Shanan: Hi Dawn Cynthia: I don't know why it zapped me... Dawn joined the chat 22 hours ago Bill: I have done one or two I believe. Bill: Hi Dawn Cynthia: that's okay Shanan it happens to all of us occasionally. Cynthia: Hi Dawn Dawn: hi Shanan Dawn: hi everyone Dawn: am i on time i missed the afternoon class Shanan: you are a bit early Cynthia: I'll add you momentarily Wally AKTATTER joined the chat 22 hours ago Shanan: we have about 30 minutes to visit AKTATTER: hello all Paige: Hi Shanan: Hi G! Shanan: I should get to stay the whole time tonight AKTATTER: Hello Jeremy, Bill Bill: Hi AKTATTER Bill: How's everything? AKTATTER: great, got your email about the fall festival Oct. 2 FLTATTER: Hello georgia AKTATTER: Glad you came early Dawn to get a good seat lol Dawn: good at least i did not miss it ya Cynthia: Hi Georgia! Wally: Hi G! Dawn: lol Wally: Thanks Cynthia AKTATTER: Paige got your homework done? AKTATTER: Wally hi ya! Claudia send greettings Paige: All of it, finally caught up from going to tat days as well! AKTATTER: great! AKTATTER: I;m going to go send a wake up note to the class brb Cynthia: brb dog needs out Shanan: So G, what are we going to tat at LLC in Oct? Shanan: oops, she left malcantara joined the chat 22 hours ago malcantara: HI ALL!!!! Bill: Hi Malcantara Shanan: Hi Mal AKTATTER: Maria Ola malcantara: g!!!!!!!! HOW ARE YOU!!!! Dawn: does anyone have the link to the project for today AKTATTER: usually just demo but we can tat something special if you want Wally: Ya terminastes tu bellotita Maria? malcantara: Bill, Shanan Hi! malcantara: no... malcantara: solo de paso por aqui....jajajaj Shanan: ok G. I know the ladies were making a lot of edging lace this spring. Cynthia: Hi Maria! malcantara: Cyn...did you recived my mail with my clunies? Wally: Yo tambien. :-D Cynthia: Yes they are awesome! AKTATTER: just fine Maria had such a good time at PTG I am getting your package ready to mail malcantara: thank you..... Cynthia: mine are shall we say pathetic but I did get 1 done this afternoon that looked like a cluny! Shanan: I am thinking I may just make a bunch of little snowflakes or something. malcantara: great G!!!!! send my the total cost ...please Shanan: Those are quick and easy and kinda mindless so I can tat and talk at the same time, lol FLTATTER: now is the time to start xmas things shanan malcantara: Cyn...I have to go...my son is coming to pic me up.....so....HAVE AA WONDERFULL CLASSS!!!!! AKTATTER: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instruct.htm AKTATTER: I will do it! Shanan: Bye Mal! Bill: Bye, hurry back. AKTATTER: oh snowflakes will be perfect as we have 2 snowflake projects coming up AKTATTER: bye maria AKTATTER: hi ya Sherry FLTATTER: oh goodie malcantara: BYE...see you all next class... Shanan: hmmm maybe a cluny snowflake??? Bill: Sounds like an idea Shanan. Wally: Cluny snowflakes sounds cute! Shanan: lol, Bill AKTATTER: oh y what a lovely idea a cluny flake Wally: Hasta luego Maira Katie Verna/occhitat joined the chat 22 hours ago Katie Verna/occhitat: hello, cluny tatters! Shanan: I'm full of good ideas, just ask me, ROFL! AKTATTER: Katie thanks for those notes about the link s I will get them fixed asap Bill: Hello, although I'm not sure I can call myself a cluny tatter. Katie Verna/occhitat: OK,AK! Cynthia: Im not yet a cluny tatter....but I did one that was recognizable! Bill: It's a matter of practice isn't it Cynthia? Wally: I haven't make a cluny like in 2 years Shanan: I think I'm addicted to clunies, I am just drawn to them. DOn't know why... Wally: I feel like a newbie CelticDreamWeaver joined the chat 22 hours ago Bill: Hmmmm. CelticDreamWeaver: Hello again everybody Bill: Hi Celtic! Wally: Hi Sherry! CelticDreamWeaver: had to cut my husband's hair Shanan: Maybe because they are not used all that much??? CelticDreamWeaver: Wally!! Cynthia: I hope so this is the second time I've tried to learn now....and the first time I got one to look reasonably like a leaf...lol Jean left this message 21 hours ago: Hi everyone. AKTATTER: hello jean, scroll down and click on join chat please Jean joined the chat 21 hours ago Cynthia: Hi Jean welcome Bill: I've heard the trick is doing a third increasing, a third the same size, and a third decreasing. AKTATTER: monedido have we met yet? Jean: I got it Shanan: Hi Jean CelticDreamWeaver: Hi Bill Bill: Hi Jean! ============================================================ Created at Chatzy.com The Online Tatting Class http://www.chatzy.com/695768390662 Visible contents as of 10 Sep 2010 17:42 UTC-05:00 (217 KB) Page 3 of 5 · Char 102446 to 153612 · Newest posts at the bottom ============================================================ AKTATTER: that is a good rule of thumb bill Bill: We're going to be star struck tonight! Cynthia: don't scare the newbies off! LOL Jean: Wally I am the one got you thread and shuttles in the silent auction. Love them. Thanks Wally: Oh yes! Jean! Wally: Hope you like them. AKTATTER: oh the silent auction was wonderful this year so many good things Jean: Hi Bill and Wally Wally: Did you tat with the thread yet? CelticDreamWeaver: Hey Jean ...did you get any pictures during Tat Days? AKTATTER: I still need a photo of Wally's drawstring bag Jean: Not yet...I am still working on a snowflake. I have practices your rolled picots. Wally: Didn't I sent it? Wally: I'll get the links now. Jean: I only saw the pic on Palmetto Tatter Guild site. I did not take any. Wally: http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/_PJv20ymp6QLo6dIR7t7k2qKfVpei0s60JX3ATUklvU?feat=directlink CelticDreamWeaver: are you here Hope Bill: By the way, does any one know someone who can translate Japanese into EngLISH? Wally: http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/9KQak85v-dv9cyTWULjtEmqKfVpei0s60JX3ATUklvU?feat=directlink Yuma Tatter joined the chat 21 hours ago Bill: Hi Yuma Yuma Tatter: Hello everyone! It's good to be back in class. i had to miss the other summer sessions. AKTATTER: did you see that goofy photo of me reading the poem? egad!! http://www.palmettotatters.org/events/TatDays2010/Pics/image153.htm AKTATTER: I was pretending to be my DH AKTATTER: welcome back Bill: I got to go see that one! Wally: http://lh5.ggpht.com/_fhNoI6oxEo4/TH7oHRFdsQI/AAAAAAAAFtQ/_zynVyMp6r8/s800/Photo-0015.jpg Jean: I am not sure what we are going to do tonigh. What do me need to start. Wally: http://lh3.ggpht.com/_fhNoI6oxEo4/TH7oGrgiQBI/AAAAAAAAFtM/zN0DxxG9CQs/s800/Photo-0014.jpg CelticDreamWeaver: you mean the one with your sexual copy of Richard's mustase Wally: There are the links to the bag. Check if you can see them Katie Verna/occhitat: AK, you never looked better! ;) Wally: Hehe... I love those photos! CelticDreamWeaver: I have a great picture of me and Richard Wally: Where can we get the poem? CelticDreamWeaver: he had to give me the bone shuttle to me all over again AKTATTER: oh thanks for posting that photo Wallt I think your bag came out so nicely. Paige did you finish a bag? AKTATTER: lol thanks Katie, ... I think CelticDreamWeaver: oh is there pictures of the finished bags from your class AK AKTATTER: it looks like it hasn't been posted at PTG yet so just email me for it CelticDreamWeaver: I think I saw a couple...one had leaves on the outside edge CelticDreamWeaver: I thought....what a cool looking hanky becoming a bag Paige: As in finish the edging? No yet. But other than that the cell phone pocket and bag are done. Just haven't unburied my camera. AKTATTER: oh great Paige, so please send in photos to share Katie Verna/occhitat: Bill, how are we to be star struck tonight? Is class moving outdoors? Special folks coming? Do you have new star patterns? Give us a hint!! AKTATTER: sexual? Sherry? you must mean my SEXY white paper moustache CelticDreamWeaver: yup CelticDreamWeaver: LOL AKTATTER: Jean we are waiting for Mimi but you will need a shuttle loaded with a couple of yards of thread and ball/shuttle2 or a ball and needle Cynthia: We have Georgia and soon we will also have Mimi both awesome tatting stars! CelticDreamWeaver: were you wearing it when you sited the poem? Bill: I'm just in awe of all the great talent here. AKTATTER: yes I ws Bernice joined the chat 21 hours ago Katie Verna/occhitat: Mimi and Georgia are the best--so fun to be back in class! Yuma Tatter: Hi Bernice...see you made it. CelticDreamWeaver: I agree Bill.....lots of talent here tonight Bill: Hi Bernice AKTATTER: well wait until the great Cluniac arrives, Mimi herself Cynthia: so am I Bill and not just Georgia and Mimi but you and everyone else...(if I can be in the group) Jean: thanks AKTATTER: hey jam pull up a seat Wally: Does anyone remembers thename of the lady that was seated beside me on the Tat Off http://www.palmettotatters.org/events/TatDays2010/Pics/2010TatDaysDT827.JPG Bernice: Yes and I think I am ready Margaret joined the chat 21 hours ago Rosemarie joined the chat 21 hours ago Margaret: Hi, Georgia and everyone else Rosemarie: Hi All AKTATTER: was that Shawna? AKTATTER: welcome Margaret and Rosemarie Rosemarie: Thank you. Bill: Hi Rosemarie! Yes you too Cynthia! skfuller joined the chat 21 hours ago Wally: Yes! I knew was a strange name. :-) CelticDreamWeaver: was she a fast tatter Wally Rosemarie: Georgia, who won the quilt at Palmetto? Margaret: hi, Bill and Cynthia skfuller: Hi EVERYONE! Bill: Hi skfuller CelticDreamWeaver: Stephanie tats really fast Wally: She made me work harder. lol Bill: Hi Margaret! Katie Verna/occhitat: Hi, Rosemarie! Margaret: on that pattern that came today, it says to do cluny leaves for the tail of the kite but doesn't describe how Wally: Steph was 2nd place and Martha 3rd Cynthia: Hi Margaret and Sue and everyone who snuck in while I was letting the dog in Rosemarie: Hi to all, glad to see you and glad to be here, too. skfuller: Hello Bill Shanan: we are up to 22 tonight Yuma Tatter: Is this the start of regular classes for the fall? Margaret: I am very proud of myself -- finished part 4 of the 12 part mystery cross-stitch sampler that some of the members have completed in totality. Going to a group on Sat. to look at our work AKTATTER: The giant quilt went to Mr. Ed Hart whose wife was a quilter and who told me to buy her a ticket. Lucky thing he did Shanan: dropped to 21, but still a great turn out!! Rosemarie: Amen!!! Barbara M joined the chat 21 hours ago Cynthia: no this is a Super September Event AKTATTER: The Dolly Parton wall hanging went to Jeanne Zukowski who is a member of the online tatting class! Barbara M: Good evening everyone. claudia joined the chat 21 hours ago Yuma Tatter: When will the classes start? AKTATTER: the regular classes begin Sept. 20th CelticDreamWeaver: are you talking about the sampler from "Gift of Stitching" Cynthia: I keep getting bumped! AKTATTER: wb Barb Bill: Hi Barbara claudia: hi girls!!! hi georgia!! Rosemarie: That's good news, too. Bill: Hi Claudia Margaret: phone Cynthia: actually next week Yuma but tonight is a special event so please stay Bernice: k AKTATTER: Margaret Mimi will be teaching us the basics of cluny tatting tonight, the tail is made from cluny leaves or tallies claudia: hi bill skfuller: Beginners class starts next Thursday Sept 16th AKTATTER: velcro for cyn{}{}{}{ Yuma Tatter: Oh, I intend to... I've missed the classes. We're still on the road, so I'll probably not be mosst of the time until mid Oct when we reach Yuma. Wally: Bienvenida de nuevo Clau Greengal: terrified of clunies AKTATTER: hi claudia claudia: hola wally, no sabia que habia clasess Winkerbill joined the chat 21 hours ago Winkerbill: hi everyone! claudia: thanks for answering my mail georgia Wally: A mi se me habia olvdado, si no fuera por Maria se me habria pasado CelticDreamWeaver: Stephanie Cynthia: relax they won't bit! Greengal: where is yuma? CelticDreamWeaver: there you are Winkerbill: Hi Sherry Wally: Stephanie!!! AKTATTER: <<< is doing better but still has a "death grip" most of the time. Mimi tip about relaxing was helpful Bill: Hi Winkerbill Winkerbill: brb - got to get some tea CelticDreamWeaver: I was just talking about how fast you tat earlier Rosemarie: Not terrified, but I tried it earlier, and I got a very nice braid, but no cluny leaf. :-D AKTATTER: Steph! you made it back intime Hope dh is feeling better Yuma Tatter: Yuma is in southern Arizona. We live full time in an RV, but are in Yuma, AZ 6 months in the winter (next door to Bernice) claudia: it seems you have a great time at palmetto Sherong joined the chat 21 hours ago MIMI joined the chat 21 hours ago shannon_in_love joined the chat 21 hours ago Sherong: Hi all Greengal: cool claudia: hi mimi!! Cynthia: Hi Mimi welcome! Margaret: hi, Katie Verna/occhitat: Hey, hi, Mimi!!!! MIMI: Thanks Cynthia. Hi everyone MIMI: Hey katie! Margaret: k Rose Anne joined the chat 21 hours ago Margaret: hi, Yuma Tatter: Hi Mimi! Margaret: hi, Margaret: imi Barbara M: Hi Mimi. Welcome & thanks for your time. MIMI: Long time no see Margaret and Bev Bernice: hi Katie Verna/occhitat: It's cluny time again, Mimi! Too fun! CelticDreamWeaver: Yuma Tatter...were you at Palmetto's Tat DAys? Cynthia: I have one odd looking cluny but I keep getting nasty knots.... Bill: Hi Rose Anne Rose Anne: Rose Anne Burdeny (AKA RAB) Winnipeg, MB CANADA raburdeny@yahoo.ca AKTATTER: Cyn do you know monedido? Bill: Hi Sherong MIMI: Knots where Cynthia? Top of the leaf? AKTATTER: wahoo Mimi is here! Yuma Tatter: No, but I'm envious! MIMI: Twisty loops? claudia: monedido? AKTATTER: hey ROse Anne and sheron glad to see you Cynthia: no I don't...AK it is a mystery to me joyces joined the chat 21 hours ago Bill: Hi Mimi! Sunela joined the chat 21 hours ago AKTATTER: ok she just left Bill: Nice to meet you. claudia: there is a link for today class? AKTATTER: sunela so good to see you here joyces: hi, I'm happy to join you tonight. Cynthia: Mimi I just get knots I think it has to do with tension on the loom Bill: Hi Sunela Wally: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instruct.htm AKTATTER: hey joyce Cynthia: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/mimi/kitescmr.html CelticDreamWeaver: Stephanie....I got my beads in the mail from Nina...I know she said she was going to send you some...so did you finish your necklace Sunela: Hi everyone.....I'm back. This cluny tatting is getting me all excited. Wally: My clunies are fuzzy leaves. lol CelticDreamWeaver: Hiya Sunela claudia: thanks wally, cyn Sunela: Hiya Sherry Sunela: Sherry, heard you had a ball at TAT days Margaret: k CelticDreamWeaver: was that from the lists? CelticDreamWeaver: I did have a grand time Yuma Tatter: k Jean: j Rose Anne: Hi everyone, I'm so excited I's flying mighty high I tell you! CelticDreamWeaver: and it isn't quite over yet Paule joined the chat 21 hours ago Sunela: Thanks Georgia.....The cluny tatting is keeping me close to the computer. I ahve been practicing since the earlier class. I am getting better but still has an issue CelticDreamWeaver: I will be seeing Sue Hanson on Saturday Cynthia: Georgia monedido was in and out earlier but I did not get any info from her/him CelticDreamWeaver: at Hector, New YOrk Bill: Hi Paule Paule: Allo everyone Sunela: Hi Bill! AKTATTER: ok cyn Katie Verna/occhitat: ; AKTATTER: Paule long time! Paule: You bet! AKTATTER: we all are Rose Anne Wally: Allo Paule! tatpat1 joined the chat 21 hours ago AKTATTER: Mimi I got another question about cluny leaves this afternoon Rose Anne: I had printed off the pattern earlier and realized no instructions for the Cluny Leaf so I went back and clicked on the link and printed off Mimi's instructions and Stephs too. Paule: Was busy being a volunteer for Ovarian Cancer Canada AKTATTER: wlcome pat tatpat1: Hi, Bill: Hi Tatpa1t MIMI: What was that Georgia? Rose Anne: Well this time I read through it once and then slowly a second time trying to wrap the fingers - got that far. JB joined the chat 21 hours ago Paule: Bonjour Wally! How are you? Rose Anne: THEN I did my FIRST Cluny Leaf - shaky but I did it!!! Margaret: for everyone's info, Fall into Tatting tat days in Cambridge ON the last weekend in Sept Bill: Hi JB JB: Hi everyone AKTATTER: she wanted to know if you can compress the weaves down, stop, throw off a ring, then continue to weave? tatpat1: Got my times mixed up this afternoon, guess I made in on time tonight. Wally: Doing so-so. I have been with asthmas since I returned to PR. :( Wally: I guess the weather is USA is MUCH better than in PR Paule: Did you get surgery? AKTATTER: Wish we could be there Margaret, say hi for all of us Lilome joined the chat 21 hours ago Lilome: Hi everuone Bill: Hi Lilome Lilome: am I late? Jean: hi Wally: They haven't give a date yet but will be around April or May next year AKTATTER: time of year is bad for pollens and molds and corn and bean chaff in the air Cynthia: no still chatting MIMI: AK: yes. I have seen similar done (Joy Critchfield experimented with it a little one time when I taught at Camp Wannatat) Bill: Not yet. claudia: hi lilome..not late Bernice: hi AKTATTER: just starting lilo Lilome: Oh good Margaret: I am not going -- only interested in one class -- there are 6 to pick 4 from AKTATTER: If you have a photo please share later thanks mimi MIMI: however, i don't care to do it myself. Hard to get the rings level with each other. I'm all about level. Lilome: Just rushed back from the shops have we started Wally: TOR from trhe middle of a clunny? MIMI: no photo, sorry. AKTATTER: right Wally I didnt even know if it could be done MIMI: right Wally Winkerbill: i have been having allergy trouble and asthma problems recently, too Wally - where I live, it's the mold spores and lots of pollen in the air that cause trouble this time of year. MIMI: anything can be done Georgia, takes patience and effort! Sherong: And sometimes it's just not worth the effort Wally: I think could be done. That's something worthy of experimenting. :D MIMI: exactly Sheron. At least for me :) AKTATTER: so true mimi but Sheron has a point is there a true purpose or just doing it because one could Wally: We are having a blast, between hurricanes, storms and volcano ashes! Yuck! Cynthia: shall we get started? Please sign in and then I'll introduce Mimi to everyone MIMI: Mimi Dillman, ntrop@ix.netcom.com Everett WA USA Winkerbill: it would be interesting to see what it looked like, though...worth a few experiments, IMHO clesliea joined the chat 21 hours ago jamlover joined the chat 21 hours ago MIMI: (at theh office...) tatpat1: OK, what did I miss, - - what this TOR from the middle Wally? Sherong: Sheron Goldin, sherongb@yahoo.com, Columbia, SC clesliea: connie angeline atlantic city nj shannon_in_love: shannon, shannon_in_love@yahoo.co​m, sacramento california Cynthia: Cynthia Stevenson Stillwater OK USA brasthatfit@yahoo.com Rosemarie: Rosemarie Weber, Baltimore, MD, USA, rweb53@verizon.net Shanan: Shanan Strode Charleston, IL USA Shanans3bs@yahoo.com shuttle Bill: I'm Bill. A maled tatter from Ohio in the USA. AKTATTER: AKTATTER@aol.com Georgia Seitz Greenup Illinois usa Winkerbill: Stephanie W in western North Carolina USA Bill: wmstem@yahoo.com Paige: Paige, crasshtesst@yahoo.com, Kernersville, North Carolina JB: JB, jl@pepper.net, Satsuma, AL Jean: Jean Khalil, Lexington, SC Wally: a thrown off ring from the middle of a cluny Barbara M: Barbara Muehl, Sequim WA, barken4@hotmail.com. Shuttle Katie Verna/occhitat: Katie Verna, katie@r-v-r.com, Creedmoor NC, 30 mi north of Raleigh, where fall is gently creeping in Shanan: sounds interesting wally tatpat1: Patsy A. Goodman, Chula Vista, CA, USA, karpap@cox.net skfuller: Sue K Fuller Loveland CO rlskfullercomcast.net bmedina joined the chat 21 hours ago FLTATTER: Jeremy Earnest fort walton beach florida, FLTATTER@AOL.COM shuttle and needle joyces: joyce schermerhorn, joycemscherm@yahoo.com, Muncie, IN Wally: Wally from PR, needledreams@yahoo.com AKTATTER: what a terrific turnout tonight and this afternoon I think Mimi didn't believe me when I mentioned how much interest there is in cluny Sunela: Sunela in new jersey, sunela@yahoo.com, shuttle Margaret: margaret i. Boos, star2lexi4me@yahoo.ca, London Ontario CANADA Bill: Hi bmedina Winkerbill: I can see it now....Wally will figure it out and next time she teaches at Tat Days, there will be classes with clunies and thrown off rings in the middle.... Yuma Tatter: yuma tatter, usually Yuma,AZ, currently Moab, UT; travelingdancers@inbox.c​om Winkerbill: and it will be FUN bmedina: Brazilian tatter, Campinas, São Paulo state Winkerbill: :-) CelticDreamWeaver: Sherry Townsend Canandaigua, New York celticdreamweave@yahoo.c​om....Hi Connie AKTATTER: wahoo wtg to go wally Wally: LOL claudia: claudia meza, argentina, cloelo@gmail.com bmedina: Beatriz Medina, the name - I forgot. Dawn: dawn niner minooka il sappda@yahoo.com tatpat1: Haven't heard of that Wally, sounds interesting. Shanan: Can't wait! Bernice: Bernice Odom fulltime living in motorhome...in DesMoines,WA right now. bmo1941@gmail.com needle Rose Anne: Here is the link to my first Cluny leaf http://tinyurl.com/3yw6xbp Greengal: Kathy Clark,Nowra NSW Aust, bobclark01@dodo.com.au needle AKTATTER: boas-vindas clesliea: hey sherry bmedina: obrigada Paule: Paule Primeau Boucherville Quebec Canada toujoursvivante@videotro​n.ca Winkerbill: Wally, i finished my bookmark with the flying rings. Looks like the picture, too! Lilome: omeb@internode.on.net Omar Bentley Australia Shanan: nice cluny! claudia: welcome bmedina!! Wally: I'll have to start with the classes for palmetto now. AKTATTER: oh that is so much better than my first tries bmedina: thank you Cynthia: Tonght we have the incredibly talented Mimi to help us learn to do clunys. Mimi the floor is yours Wally: h! Send me a photo if you can. Schwarino is having a good time looking at the class photos. Cynthia: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/mimi/kitescmr.html for the kite skfuller: Great first cluny Rose Anne! Margaret: Hi, MIMI Cynthia: http://www.georgiaseitz.com/2003/patclunyloom.html for a loom Wally: That cluny looks much better than mine too. Winkerbill: i'm having trouble with the scanner....and don't have a camera. Maybe I can find someone who has a phone and can take a picture with it.... AKTATTER: http://www.georgiaseitz.com/classes2001/cluny/gsfirstcluny.jpg white were by hand green were with plastic loom MIMI: Are we doing the pattern first, Cynthia, or how to make the leaves? I think a lot of folks here already know how to make them? Cynthia: http://needledreams.tripod.com/clunnyleaves/id6.html for pics of the hand doing a cluny Wally: I like the colors you used for the bookmark. Margaret: what is the 'loom' for and do I need one with needle? MIMI: In the otehr class we did the how- to-make-leaves Rose Anne: And Georgia do you notice I'm using the tortoise shuttles I just got from you - I LOVE them. Lilome: k Barb joined the chat 21 hours ago Cynthia: let's ask...as there are some who missed the afternoon class Lilome: em me me clesliea: rumor has it there is a new way to wrap the hand loom jamlover: this isn't the beginner class?? Wally: I couldn't thanks you for the pretty doily. Had to pry it off from mom's hands. lol Lilome: But If I'm the only one please just go ahead Barb: Barb Grainger Oregon USA sonsery@aol.com Cynthia: if you need the clumy info please key in cluny Shanan: MIMI, I was waiting to ask you a question about cluny clusters and I almost forgot! Jean: l bmedina: I missed the afternoon class, was at work Winkerbill: you're welcome. I'm glad you were there this year. Wally: i missed the other session too Bernice: cluny Yuma Tatter: I missed the class, but i did a few clunys when attempting the nativity scr Cynthia: We have 34 online tonight! Rosemarie: Help! I'm having trouble opening th links, they keep coming up broken. jamlover: I apologize to all., I invaded where I do not belong!! Winkerbill: Wow! I sure have missed everyone. It's fun to get together for class again. Yuma Tatter: oops nativity scene from an earlier class...which I still need to finish ;-) Cynthia: Shanan: Does anyone know how to keep a center cluster of clunies together? Is their a trick to joining them? was Shanan's question from earlier MIMI: The links I prefer to use to teach from : Shanan: Is there a trick to joining clunies in a cluster? JB: cluny AKTATTER: Jam in cluny tatting we are all beginners Winkerbill: Stay with us Jamlover. Bill: Stick around jamlover. This is a special event for all tatters of any level. Cynthia: Jam lover are you a tatter? Dawn: i missed the afternoon class MIMI: With shuttle in the photos: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instruct.htm Rose Anne: WOW that is more than we've ever had isn't it? MIMI: With needle in the photos: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/cluny/instructneedle.htm AKTATTER: this is a special event please stay tatpat1: I missed the afternoon class, but can struggle through the clunys Cynthia: all tatters are welcome! MIMI: Please keep in mind that making these leaves is the same process regardless of shuttle or needle Cynthia: Mimi please go to caps so we can find you easier MIMI: The only difference is what is being used to guide the thread through the weaving - shuttle or needle. MIMI: So the picutres are really pretty much the same. Rose Anne: Yep that is the link for the cluny that I used and very easy to follow. MIMI: These leaves have been around a long time in lace. Margaret: hi, Barb, you made it Lilome: k MIMI: The needle lacers made them first. MIMI: Then bobbin lacemakers imitated them in their bobbin lace(as they did so many other needlelace elements) Jean: k MIMI: Then the crocheters imitated the NL and BL Winkerbill: So you dont' have to wrap a DS on one of the threads before you start weaving? Or do you? some instructions say yes, some say no. claudia: mimi, can you write in caps? MIMI: And some very smart lady tatter MIMI: THANKS CLAUDIA Winkerbill: When I do it with the wrapped DS first, I get knots. Margaret: clkuny MIMI: SOME VERY SMART TATTER FIGURED OUT HOW TO DO ONE IN TATTING MIMI: I HAVE NOT FOUND ANY DOCUMENTATION FOR PATTERNS/INSTRUCTIONS ANY EARLIER THAN THE 19-TEENS MIMI: IF YOU KNOW OF ANY EARLIER PLEASE LET ME KNOW Bill: It was probably a lady. MIMI: I PERSONALLY LEARNED FROM MONICA HAHN, THE SAME ONE WHO AUTHORED TATTING BOOK AVAILABLE FROM DOVER MIMI: THAT SO MANY FOLKS HAVE. MIMI: WE WERE SO LUCKY TO HAVE HER IN OUR GROUP! Margaret: I was not in afternoon class and what in the world is a 'loom', why do we need it and how doe I get started on it? MIMI: I HAD TRIED FROM A BOOK, BUT SHE HAD A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT WAY OF MAKING THE LOOM ON HER HAND MIMI: AND SUDDENLY I COULD MAKE THEM! MIMI: SO THAT IS THE METHOD I SHOW IN THE 2 LINKS I GAVE YOU Rose Anne: good Katie Verna/occhitat: Dear Mona Hahn. I have the fondest memories of her. Cynthia: Margaret the loom is the part wrapped around your hand Sherong: Margaret: Check out the class links. A loom holds the thread so you don't have to keep a death grip Rosemarie: I need some help here. When I click on to all of the links, they come up broken. What should I do? MIMI: ELISADUSUD HAS CHANGED A SMALL BIT AGAIN ON THE LOOM METHOD. I DO NOT HAVE ANY INSTRUCTIONS MIMI: TO SHARE ON THAT TONIGHT AKTATTER: me too such a kind lady MIMI: SO IN THE INTEREST OF TIME I'LL TELL YOU MY WAY Lilome: k Bill: Some people use a platic loom as it hurts their hands to hold the loom on it. MIMI: THEN YOU CAN SEE THE TOEHRS, INCLUDING USING A HAND-HELD LOOM RATHER THAN YOUR HAND MIMI: TO DETERMINE WHICH WAY YOU LIKE BEST MIMI: LIKE MOST TATTING TECHNIQUES, THERE'S MORE THAN ONE WAY TO GET THE SAME RESULT MIMI: SO ITS UP TO THE TATTER TO CHOOSE WHAT WORKS BEST FOR HER/HIM claudia: k Winkerbill: my cluny tallies are short and fat when I use a plastic star loom, longer and thinner with the same number of weaves if i use my fingers as the loom AKTATTER: http://www.georgiaseitz.com/2003/patclunyloom.html Lilome: I Like the idea of making the loom on your hand Wally: Someone of the Spanish Tatters group makes a loom in her pants. I will try to get the link later. Rose Anne: I can't wait to try this with thicker cotton and in green for actual leaves on my CQing projects. MIMI: MAKING THE LEAF IS BASICALLY A 3 STEP PROCESS Margaret: k MIMI: 1. FORMING THE LOOM (ON THE HAND/LOOM/ARMCHAIR ARM/SLACKS, WHATEVER) MIMI: 2. WEAVING THE LEAF ITSELF MIMI: 3. REMOVING THE LOOM LOOPS FROM THE WORK, LEAVING ONLY THE LEAF Rose Anne: wow that's neat on the plastic canvas MIMI: FIRST STEP: SETTING UP THE LOOM THREADS AKTATTER: hand came first tho AKTATTER: another version http://www.frontiernet.net/~tammyrodgers/loom-1.html tatpat1: ok clesliea: and there is where i go awry MIMI: IF YOU ARE GOING TO FOLLOW ALONG, YOU WILL NEED EITHER SHUTTLE/NEEDLE AND BALL THREAD, OR 2 SHUTTLES MIMI: TIE THEM TOGETHER SO YOU HAVE A KNOT THAT CAN STAND IN PLACE OF A PREVIOUS RING, CHAIN, OR LEAF claudia: k Rose Anne: I did mine with 2 shuttles as suggested for beginners AKTATTER: a third type http://www.georgiaseitz.com/2007/edwigerenaudincluny.jpg MIMI: ALSO, FOR THE HAND I WILL CALL THE PARTS AS FOLLOWS MIMI: PINCH: THUMB AND FOREFINGER AKTATTER: but still the hand loom is the best MIMI: 3RD FINGER = MIDDLE FINGER MIMI: 4TH FINGER = RING FINGER, THE ONE BETWEEN THE MIDDLE FINGER AND LITTLE FINGER MIMI: 5TH FINGER OR PINKY, THE LITTLEST FINGER MIMI: OK HERE WE GO AKTATTER: k MIMI: GRASP THE PREVIOUS WORK (OR KNOT) IN YOUR PINCH Wally: . Greengal: k Margaret: for the knot, on needle, do I just tie one in the middle of my thread going from needle to ball? Yuma Tatter: . MIMI: TO START THE LOOM, TAKE THE BALL THREAD FROM THE PINCH UPWARDS BEHIND THE 3RD AND 4TH FINGERS MIMI: SURE MARGARET WHATEVER WORKS MIMI: THEN BACK TO THE PINCH ***OVER THE TOP OF THE FOREFINGER INTO THE PINCH*** MIMI: DIRECTION NIS IMPORTANT Lilome: k Rosemarie: k MIMI: SO THAT THE BALL THREAD IS HEADING DOWN TOWARD YOUR LAP Rose Anne: k MIMI: NEXT GUIDE THE BALL THREAD BETWEEN THE 4TH AND 5TH FINGERS AND BACK TO THE PINCH MIMI: APPROACHING THE PINCH FROM UP FROM YOUR LAP AND UPWARD TOWARD YOUR FINGERS Barb: k Bernice: k MIMI: THIS 2ND LOOP IS BASICALLY A LOOP AROUND YOUR PINKY FROM UNDER YOUR PINCH claudia: k MIMI: LAST, GUIDE THE BALL THREAD GOING UP FROM THE PINCH TO BETWEEN THE 3RD AND 4TH FINGERS, AKTATTER: Margaret http://needledreams.tripod.com/clunnyleaves/id6.html for needle cluny MIMI: AND THEN TIE THIS THREAD OFF ON THE 5TH FINGER Bill: k MIMI: YOU WILL SEE THAT YOU HAVE 3 VERTICAL THREADS FROM YOUR PINCH PLUS A PINKY LOOP AKTATTER: k MIMI: IGNORE THE PINKY LOOP MIMI: BUT THIS LOOP IS THE HANDY BIT THAT MONA TAUGHT ME. KEEPING THAT LOOP THERE WILL HELP LATER BELIEVE ME MIMI: THE IMPORTANT PART WILL BE THE 3 VERTICAL THREADS THAT GO BETWEEN THE PINCH AND YOUR 3RD AND 4TH FINGERS MIMI: EVERYONE HAVE THEIR HAND "LOOMED" UP? bmedina: k Yuma Tatter: yep AKTATTER: all ready skfuller: yup Dawn: yep!!!!! :) claudia: k ============================================================ Created at Chatzy.com The Online Tatting Class http://www.chatzy.com/695768390662 Visible contents as of 10 Sep 2010 17:42 UTC-05:00 (217 KB) Page 4 of 5 · Char 153613 to 204809 · Newest posts at the bottom ============================================================ MIMI: OK THEN DROP IT OFF AND FLEX YOUR FINGERS, ALLOWING THE CIRCULATION TO RETURN (END OF YOUR PINKY IS PROBABLY PURPLE BY NOW!) Rosemarie: yes Winkerbill: y Bernice: kind of MIMI: i CAN HEAR YOUR GROANS. I KNOW THIS SEEMS SILLY TO DROP IT, BUT THE WEAVING TAKES SOME TIME Paige: k MIMI: SO IT'S BEST TO START OVER AGAIN BEFORE TRYING TO WEAVE. YOU'LL MAKE THE LOOM FASTER THE 2ND TIME AND PRACTICE ALWAYS HELPS Greengal: k Lilome: k clesliea joined the chat 21 hours ago MIMI: I DON'T WANT ANYONE LOSING ANY FINGERS! joyces: yes tatpat1: ok Rose Anne: I can't read and tat so I'll just wait till after to try more for the kite tail. JB: yep MIMI: SHAKE THOSE HANDS BELOW YOUR WAIST! FLEX THEM! FLTATTER: loom works well Bill: k Barb: ... MIMI: EVERYONE GOT CIRCULATION BACK YET?SO DO THE LOOM AGAIN Alizandria joined the chat 21 hours ago MIMI: PINCH THE WORK AKTATTER: hi ya Aliz welcome back MIMI: BALL THREAD UP FROM PINCH BEHIND 3&4 Alizandria: sneeking in late.....hi everybody... :) Rose Anne: I couldn't believe the numbness that first time! MIMI: BALL THREAD TOP TO BOTTOM OF PINCH MIMI: BALL THREAD FROM BOTTOM OF PINCH BETWEEN 4&5 MIMI: BEHIND 5 AND BACK TO PINCH FROM BELOW MIMI: BALL THREAD FROM PINCH UPWARD TO BETWEEN 3&4 MIMI: TIE OFF ON 5 Greengal: k MIMI: THEN YOU'RE READY TO PICK UP YOUR FAVORITE IMPLEMENT TO WEAVE! bmedina: k Margaret: I CAN'T DO THIS - i am reading way behind and the page keeps moving so i can't follow AKTATTER: k Linda NM joined the chat 21 hours ago AKTATTER: just read along Margaret Barb: Mimi.. What do you mean 'tie off' ? AKTATTER: look at the photos later Barb: Does that mean to just wrap it around your pinkie? MIMI: WIND THE BALL THREAD AROUND YOUR PINKY TO HOLD IT IN PLACE AND KEEP THE TENSION ON THAT THREAD MIMI: EXACTLY BARB ;) AKTATTER: That is what I do just below the first knuckle 2-3 wraps Rosemarie: k Cynthia: Margaret yes you can do this just read along and try it later. You can save it and read it later too MIMI: i WAS BEING TOO TELEGRAPHIC AND FAST. Rose Anne: I printed off the Cluny Leaf instructions and had them in my lap while trying. Barb: :) Cynthia: that helps RoseAnne MIMI: THERE WAS A QUESTION EARLIER ABOUT WHETHER TO MAKE A DS BEFORE STARTING TO WEAVE Bill: Also, I will volunteer to help anyone later. MIMI: PERSONALLY, I DON'T BOTHER Lilome: k Rose Anne: and lots easier to catch onto than TATTING period - LOL! AKTATTER: wow how do you keep te tension then? Cynthia: Margaret this is my second try at learning clunys and the first time I got one to come close! claudia: - Bernice: k MIMI: BUT IF YOU HAVE DIFFICULTY DRAWING THE FIRST WEAVE TIGHT ENOUGH TO MAKE A POINT AT THE END, joyces: i've never tied off before. this will really help keep the tension on the middle thread MIMI: THEN BY ALL MEANS, MAKE A DS TO PULL THEM ALL TOGETHER Margaret: I am leaving. Must phone Winnipeg Manitoba tonight to the closest friend my uncle had. He died on Monday Rose Anne: Hi Margaret - I'm in Winnipeg Yuma Tatter: sorry, Bill: Margaret, don't hesitate to email me at wmstem@yahoo.com Cynthia: I'm sorry MARGARET AKTATTER: come again margaret MIMI: WEAVING IN A TATTED LEAF IS THE SAME AS WEAVING IN OTHER DISCIPLINES Sunela: Mimi, my cluny top curves good, but the bottom looks kind of straight. Am i doing something wrong or is that lack of practice? Yuma Tatter: Margaret, our thoughts are with your family Bernice: prayers Margaret: thanks for all the condolences. Last evening I copied many pictures for him so I could make him a scrapbook, not knowing that he had already died MIMI: SORRY TO HEAR MARGARET. SEE YOU NEXT TIME I HOPE Lilome: I'm going to have to try later Margaret left the chat 21 hours ago Lilome: I'll just read and print off later ] MIMI: WEAVING THREAD GOES UNDER / OVER / UNDER IN ONE DIRECTION OF WEAVING ACROSS THE LOOM MIMI: THEN OVER/UNDER/OVER IN THE OTHER DIRECTION (OTHERWISE YOU PULL OUT YOUR WEAVING!) Rose Anne: k Barb: ... claudia: k MIMI: THE SHAPING IS DONE WHILE YOU WEAVE. DON'T MAKE ANOTHER WEAVING PASS UNTIL THE PREVIOUS PASS IS THE SHAPE YOU LIKE MIMI: IT IS VERY DIFFICULT TO CHANGE IT AFTER YOU HAVE WOVEN PAST. Lilome: k Sunela: ok AKTATTER: ah ha hmm MIMI: SHAPING TO YOUR TASTE COMES WITH PRACTICE tatpat1: ok Bill: k Greengal: as u do it do you move your thumb up over the part u have woven MIMI: SUNELA I SUSPECT THAT YOU ARE NOT PULLING THE WEAVES WIDE ENOUGH ON THE WAY UP Rose Anne: I used the point of my shuttle to keep the angle I wanted Linda NM: does that depend how tight you pull the threads when weaving to shape it?? Yuma Tatter: mimi on that first weave, is the shuttle thread forming a loop around the index finger or coming up thru the pinch? MIMI: I PULL OUTWARD ON THE LOOM THREADS TO FORCE THE WOVEN THREAD WIDER MIMI: THEN THE PICK OF THE SHUTTLE TO PACK IT DOWN. MIMI: THE FIRST WEAVE SHOULD BE RIGHT NEXT TO THE PREVIOUS WORK MIMI: THE SHUTTLE DOING THE WEAVING SHOULD NOT LEAVE ANY LOOPS MIMI: ANY LOOPS LEFT BY THE WEAVING SHUTTLE WILL BE ***PERMANENT*** MIMI: SO IF YOU WANT A LOOPY LEAF, NOW YOU KNOW HOW TO MAKE IT :) Rose Anne: ooops I have a few loose ends - guess I'll have to tighten up a bit then Barb: ... MIMI: THAT'S RIGHT ROSEANNE Shanan: would a loopy leaf be one you could join to then? MIMI: MOST BEGINNERS GET "HOLLY LEAVES" OR OTHER UNEXPECTED SHAPE VARIETIES Shanan: I mean join to the side of the leaf? MIMI: SOMETIMES THAT'S GOOD! Lilome: k FLTATTER: yeah really Dawn: if your getting a braid what are u doing wrong MIMI: SHANAN YOU CAN JOIN TO A LEAF ANYTIME. JUST JAM YOUR CROCHET HOOK IN WHERE YOU WANT IT. IF THAT IS OUTSIDE THE LOOM THREADS, YOU WILL HAVE TO GO SIDEWAYS TO GET A LOOP MIMI: BEWARE PULLING THE LEAF OUT OF SHAPE WHEN YOU DO THIS MIMI: HOLD WHAT YOU CAN TIGHT IN YOUR PINCH Shanan: maybe not packing your weaves close enough while weaving MIMI: THEN MANIPULATE A LITTLE AFTER THE JOIN Shanan: Thanks Mimi MIMI: WHEN I WEAVE - REMEMBER I'M A RIGHT HANDED SHUTTLE TATTER Rose Anne: k MIMI: I START ON THE RIGHT AND SEND THE SHUTTEL UNDER THE LOOM THREAD THAT GOES FROM MIMI: PINCH TO OUTSIDE OF 4TH FINGER MIMI: THEN OVER THE MIDDLE THREAD - THE ONE THAT GOES PINCH TO BETWEEN 3&4 Cynthia: Dawn I think you and I are not getting the loom tension quite right MIMI: THEN LAST UNDER THE THREAD GOING FROM PINCH TO OUTSIDE OF 3RD FINGER Cynthia: I have the same problem tatpat1: Is it wise to try to join to the side of a leaf. Wouldn't it be better to join at the ends of a leaf? MIMI: ON THE WAY BACK, I USE THE SHUTTLE TO LIFT THE CENTER THREAD (THE ONE FROM PINCH TO BETWEEN 3 AND 4) Shanan: If the middle thread is not tight enough then that might be your problem Dawn and Cyn Barb: .. MIMI: DAWN IF YOU GET A BRAID YOU ARE NOT KEEPING YOUR LOOM THREADS VERY WIDE. YOU MAY NEED TO SPREAD YOUR FINGERS Lilome: I just went back and had a look at the wonderful pictures and I could make the loom ...I think Rose Anne: yeah! MIMI: PAT - ENDS OF THE LEAF ARE ALWAYS LEAST LIKELY TO DEFORM WHEN JOINED TO. FLTATTER: it works wonders MIMI: BUT I AHVE SEEN JOINS EVERYWHERE. MIMI: AK!!! RING OFF LEAF PHOTO!! FINALLY I REMEMBERED. JUDI BANASHEK DID THIS EVEN BEFORE JOY MIMI: SEE ADVANCED TATTING PATTERNS PLUS MIMI: PHOTOS THERE Bill: I need a lot more practice. MIMI: REMEMBER JUDI USES HER "TOE HOLD" LOOM WHICH WOULD HELP STOPPING INT HE MIDDLE TO THROW OFF RING Barb: Where Mimi?? MIMI: SORYR!! I LEFT EVERYONE WITH LOOM ON!!! Rose Anne: I stay away from advanced tatting patterns just yet! MIMI: THAT WAS A TOTAL ASIDE BARBMS ORRY Rose Anne: I've not finished with my first set of beginner lesssons as yet MIMI: DID EVERYONE FINISH THEIR WEAVING? claudia: where are those pictures mimi? bmedina: k MIMI: MISSHAPPEN LEAVES OK, WE'RE DEALING WITH TECHNIQUE NOW, COSMETICS COME LATER WITH PRACTICE Rosemarie: Well, it's looking a little better than this afternoon - Yay! MIMI: PHOTOS ARE IN A BOOK CALLED ADVANCED TATTING PATTERNS PLUS, SORRY, NOT ONLINE Sherong: Need to go. See you all next class. MIMI: YAY ROSEMARIE Bill: Thank-you Mimi. Greengal: what do i do at end MIMI: THAKS FOR COMING SHERON claudia: ok MIMI: ONCE YOU HAVE COMPLETED WEAVING MIMI: IT'S TIME TO CAREFULLY TAKE THE WORK OFF YOUR HAND. Greengal: eek Rose Anne: this is where I had trouble MIMI: FIRST SET ASIDE THE WEAVING SHUTTLE/NEEDLE SO THAT YOU KNOW WHERE IT IS MIMI: LENGTHEN THE THREAD AND PUT IT ON THE FLOOR IF YOU HAVE TO Bill: k Greengal: k Rose Anne: did that MIMI: IT IS VERY IMPORTANT ***NOT*** TO PULL ON THIS THREAD YET! bmedina: k MIMI: NEXT UNWIND THE THREAD FROM YOUR PINKY clesliea: by sharon AKTATTER: Judi's book is a real treasure to have it explains so many techniques MIMI: (YOU KNOW, THE PURPLY-BLACK FINGER?) Lilome: I think i haVE THAT BOOH Rose Anne: k bmedina: k Greengal: k MIMI: THEN TAKE THE LOOP OFF YOUR PINKY MIMI: YOU WILL SEE WHAT LOOKS LIKE A WOVEN THINGY WITH A LOOP AND 2 THREADS COMING OUT THE TOP MIMI: AND A LOOP AT THE BOTTOM bmedina: k MIMI: PULL ON THAT BOTTOM LOOP SO THAT YOU MAKE THE TOP LOOP SMALLER Paige: k MIMI: I RECOMMEND LEAVING YOUR FINGERS IN THAT LOOP MIMI: UNTIL THE LOOP IS TOO SMALL TO KEEP THEM THERE MIMI: THAT THREAD SOMETIMES TWISTS UP Rose Anne: how do you keep it from twisting? MIMI: LIKE WHEN YOU CLOSE A RING MIMI: THE ONLY WAY i HAVE FOUND IS TO KEEP MY FINGER IN TO KEEP THE THREAD TAUT AS LONG AS POSSIBLE MIMI: THEN PINCH IT WITH THE LEAF TO DRAW THE REST IN Rose Anne: k bmedina: k MIMI: NOW YOU WILL HAVE 2 THREADS AT THE TOP - ONE OF WHICH IS GOING TO YOUR SHUTTLE/NEEDLE THAT YOU WON'T TOUCH MIMI: AND A LONG LOOP AT THE BOTTOM MIMI: YOU WILL NEED TO PULL THE BALL THREAD UP MIMI: TO MAKE THAT BOTTOM LOOP SMALLER MIMI: AGAIN THE LOOP MAY TEND TO TWIST AKTATTER: k Rose Anne: yep sure does tatpat1: ok MIMI: SO KEEP A FINGER IN IT TO GET IT TAUT ONCE IT GETS SMALLER MIMI: AND KEEP IT UNDER CONTROL MIMI: YOU ARE THE BOSS!! :) Lilome: K bmedina: hey, it's magic! MIMI: YAY!!! IT'S CLOSED! AND HOPEFULLY NO SPARE LOOPS Rose Anne: huh yeah but they don't listen Cynthia: I see my twisty knotty probem...I will do this...I think I can, I know I can.... Bernice: k Cynthia: woo hoo bmedina! Rose Anne: just a few iffy ones claudia: ok MIMI: ONE PERSON I CORRESPONDED WITH CALLS HER LEAVES "SQUASHED BUGS" Barb: ... Bill: I need more practice! MIMI: WHEN YOU ARE PRACTICING Barb: lol MIMI: ALSO PRACTICE A MOER RELAXED HOLD ON YOUR LOOM THREADS Rose Anne: I can't believe I ignored Cluny patterns cause it looked difficult - yet with some practice it's manageable. clesliea: i frequently get a small loop left at the bottom any ideas on what causes that MIMI: IT IS POSSIBLE TO KEEP TENSION ON TEH LOOM WITH SLIGHTLY CURVED FINGERS Lilome: K FLTATTER: i like using the plastic canvas loom it keeps tension better MIMI: IF YOU HAVE A SMALL LOOP AT THE BOTTOM, Bernice: I thought it wasn't going to pull up but it did....I have a kind of a leaf....need practice but it is neat. Rosemarie: Oh my goodness that is really cool. MIMI: MOST LIKELY IT'S A FORM OF GAPSOSIS Greengal: ding dang twisty knotty thing at end Shanan: I have to go. DH is home from work, but I have a question before I go. You can answer it at the end of class if you like, but I need to see if anyone can help. Does anyone know how to keep a center cluster of clunies together? Is their a trick to joining them? I can't get them to stay nice and tight when I make 6 or 8 in a cluster. Yuma Tatter: good going, Bernice... knew you'd like them MIMI: THAT IS, YOU MAY NOT HAVE PULLED THE WEAVING THREAD ENOUGH TO KEEP FROM LEAVING A BIT AT THE BEGINNING MIMI: THIS CAN ALSO HAPPEN IF YOU USE A LOOM THAT COMES IWTH INSTRUCTIONS TO PUT THE PREVIOUS WORK BEHIND TEH LOOM FLTATTER: it does work MIMI: HOW CAN YOU GET THE WEAVING CLOSE TO THE WORK WHEN THE WORK IS BEHIND THE LOOM I ASK!!?\ AKTATTER: Shanan look at this join http://www.georgiaseitz.com/2007/alligatorjoin.html FLTATTER: it will take practice MIMI: I'M SO GLAD PEOPLE IS GETTING THE LOOM DOWN Cynthia: Shannon I'll make sure Mimi gets the question MIMI: SHANAN DO YOU MAKE A PICOT IN THE MIDDLE TO JOIN TO? Bernice: Thanks Mimi Paule: Ithink I pulled on the wrong thread to close the leaf... Cynthia: Georgia how would it work with a cluny? I think that is Shanan;s question MIMI: THE ALLIGATOR WORKS ONCE YOU HAVE A SPOT TO ALLIGATOR TO. MIMI: OH NO PAULE! tHAT'S WHY I SAID SET THE SHUTTLE WAY FAR AWAY Shanan: I leave a small space to join to MIMI: YOU MAY BE ABLE TO FLIP THINGS BAD MIMI: BY LOOSENING THE TOP WITH A HOOK OR PICK MIMI: AND PULLING AGAIN ON THE BALL THRAED MIMI: I MEANT; FLIP THINGS back BACK BACK MIMI: JEEPERS WHAT A TIME FOR A TYPO Lilome: K Shanan: I will give G's suggestion a try and see if that works better AKTATTER: well we have a flower by Elisa du Sud coming up on the 20th where several cluny leaves meet in the center like flower petals and my best guess is that she captured the previous clunies like the alligator join MIMI: BUT IF YYOU HAVE TUGGED TOO HARD ON THE TOP WITH THE WEAVING SHUTTLE AKTATTER: lol MIMI: IT MAY BE DIFFICULT TO GET IT UNDONE. BUT DO TRY Yuma Tatter: Got to go, Mimi...thanks so much for the class...even though I'd done a few, appreciated your extra tips! I think I'll try the kite tomorrow! Yuma Tatter: See everyone in class once I get to Yuma! MIMI: I'M GOING TO TRY THE ALLIGATOR THING BEFORE THAT CLASS GEORGIA MIMI: THANKS FOR COMING BEV Cynthia: We'll do a Q and A on the kite after class the 16th Rose Anne: k now onto trying more Clunies and then the kite! MIMI: THE KITE PATTERN IS GREAT FOR BEGINNERS AKTATTER: great Mimi it will be good to know if that is the method Rose Anne: Thanks everyone - this was really informative! MIMI: BECAUSE THE DESIGN IS INTENDED TO HAVE LEAVES OF DIFFERENT SIZES AND LEGNTHS! AKTATTER: Elisa's directions are minimal but there is a good diagram Rosemarie: Thanks for the class Mimi. I'll be practicing this a lot. MIMI: OTHERWISE IT WOULD NOT LOOK LIKE A RIBBON TWISTING IN THE BREEZE clesliea: is it possible that it's a swirl join? AKTATTER: i can't wait to do some cluny patterns Rose Anne: Good night! I'm off to tatting and watching baseball. Winkerbill: I think that may be my problem - I have a tendency to just let the shuttle drop....and it must pull something out of place...and I end up with a big knot that won't close about 50 percent of the time. MIMI: INTERESTING IDEA LESLIE Winkerbill: I'll be more careful. Shanan: This is what I keep getting http://groups.yahoo.com/group/newshuttlesandneedles/photos/recent/836857834/view AKTATTER: I can't think that would work but connie the only way to know is to try it out MIMI: I'LL HAVE TO LOOK BACK AT ELISADUSUD'S ARCHIVES AND SEE IF SHE HAS ANY OF THOSE FLOWERS IN PROGRESS Paule: I'll try... It was coming alon beautifully... MIMI: IN ANY OF THE PHOTOS MIMI: SORRY CONNIE I DO KNOW YOUR NAME Linda NM: Thanks Mimi for the valuable info. Someday I will try the clunies...Good night all MIMI: I'M A BIT TIRED, SORRY MIMI: YOURE WELCOME LINDA clesliea: actually i'm both connie and leslie AKTATTER: we need a cluny snowflake too Sunela: Mimi thanks a bunch joyces: great lesson tonight. i learned about tying off on my little finger. Now I want to make the kite. claudia: thanks so much mimi.. very clear your instructions.. have to practice, practice, practice Lilome: Thanks Mimi I'm going to try these clunies. You've made them less scarey bmedina: Thank you a lot, Mimi Paule: I did it! AKTATTER: as always mimi your cluny explanations are the best bmedina: I never was able to understand it! MIMI: I MET YOU AS CONNIE FIRST!! Paule: My first cluny! Winkerbill: great, so now I have a finger with "color," too. My DH has a green thumb....I have a purple 5th finger. bmedina: And now I've made TWO clunies! Winkerbill: ;-) MIMI: I'M SO HAPPY YOU LIKED THE LESSON AKTATTER: rah lilome who's afraid of the big bad cluny, not us! Shanan: thanks G and Mimi - you are wonderful ladies!!! Lilome: have to go Bye all Dawn: mimi thank you, I will keep at it till i get it!!! MIMI: I HAD THOUGH EVERYONE WHO WANTED TO MAKE THEM HAD ALREADY TRIED Bernice: I will try the kite soon. Thanks MIMI: LOL GEORGIA Rosemarie joined the chat 20 hours ago Winkerbill: your explanations are really easy to understand Mimi MIMI: WERE TEHRE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE CLASS THAT WERE NOT COVERED? Sunela: Good night all.... clesliea: thank you Mimi Sunela left the chat 20 hours ago Bill: I also think you did a WONDERFUL job Mimi. And the instructions on the page are very clear. MIMI: SEVERAL WERE PUT IN EARLY ON WHILE IW AS GETTNIG STRTED clesliea: is there another way to wrap Rosemarie: Where is the kite pattern, please. Katie Verna/occhitat: Awesome lesson, Mimi. I needed the review as I haven't made them for a long time. Now to practice enough to tat an elisadusud design. claudia: my question will appear after more practice i think Greengal: GRRRR was going soo well and got a know. splat disater Dawn: I did finish the dragon I will have to post !!!! now I have to start the kite!!! clesliea: krystledawn mentioned MIMI: YOU DON'T FORGET DO YOU CONNIE :) Paule: I will print off everything and study it clesliea: never MIMI: IF YOU LOOK AT ELISADUSUD'S VIDEOS clesliea: sory clesliea: sorry Cynthia: I need a lot of practice before I get the clunys down but at least I got one done...more like a roly poly squashed bug but it has potential! Barb: .. MIMI: SHE HAS A VARIATION OF THE LOOM IN MY INSTRUCTIONS Shanan: night everyone! MIMI: ANOTHER INSTANCE OF JUST HOW SMART SHE IS Greengal: With the kite pattern do you just start the 2nd cluny immediately after the 1st Winkerbill: ooh, yeah, Cynthia, mine looks like yours! clesliea: I have seen her video clesliea: didn MIMI: EXCACTLY GREENGAL joyces: i'm off to start that kite. good night all clesliea: didn't notice the difference clesliea: have to check that out Rosemarie: Where is the kite pattern? MIMI: MAKE SURE TO WEAVE THE 2ND DIRECTLY AGAINST THE TOP OF THE 1ST Barb: Mimi do you have a link for her videos? CelticDreamWeaver: What dragon MIMI: KITE: http://home.netcom.com/~ntrop/mimi/kitescmr.html CelticDreamWeaver: did I miss something MIMI: BRB I'LL GET THE LINK Cynthia: Next weel is the first fall class start. See all the beginners then. Greengal: dragon???? pricking up my ears too claudia: where can we see that video? on elisa website? Dawn: the last class the seahorse dragon Winkerbill: I think I missed the dragon too. AKTATTER: that was a great pattern MIMI: FIRST, THE BEST EYE CANDY IN THE INTERNET TATTING WORLD: http://elisadusud.canalblog.com Cynthia: Look at the August Dragon's lesson Greengal: Oh that one. tatpat1: ok MIMI: HER VIDEOS ARE UNDER "APPRENTISSAGE" Dawn: here is that pattern Dawn: http://nuperelle.net/drager/monstre/seahorsedragon.pdf MIMI: DIRECT LINKS: MIMI: POINT D'ESPRIT PREMIERE PARTIE MIMI: (CLUNY LEAF FIRST PART) MIMI: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2w9sj_frivolite-le-point-d-esprit-premier_creation Greengal: It was great but think anneb and who ever made the original pattern sgould adapt it and add some clunies to make a leafy sea dragon MIMI: FIN DU POINT D'ESPRIT CelticDreamWeaver: wow...what tatting MIMI: (END OF CLUNY LEAF) AKTATTER: really close up photos of cluny weaving http://mordueparladentelle.wordpress.com/2009/04/03/cluny-tallies-the-start-finish/ MIMI: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2wa4n_fin-du-point-d-esprit_creation CelticDreamWeaver: does she have a book or something Barb: Thank you mimi.. I have seen her unvelievable site but never knew about the videos Rosemarie: Thanks for the pattern Mimi. AKTATTER: elise's how to video http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2w9sj_frivolite-le-point-d-esprit-premier_creation MIMI: THE DIFFERENCE IN THE LOOM: MIMI: ELISA MAKES A RING WITH SHUTTLE 2 MIMI: THAT IS TO SAY MIMI: SHE STARTS THE LOOM AS IF SHE'S STARTING A RING MIMI: FROM PINCH UP AROUND THE BACK OF ALL FINGERS AND BACK UP AND INTO THE PINCH claudia: ok. thanks MIMI: THEN SHE LENGTHENS THE SHUTTLE 2 THREAD clesliea: ah I do remember that MIMI: AT LEAST 6-8 INCHES Barb: rats. having trouble with the links tonight, they won't work most of the time. MIMI: THEN SHE PULLS THE RING THREAD DOWN FROM BETWEEN THE 4TH AND PINKY FINGERS MIMI: AND HOOKS IT OVER THE PINCH (WATCH OUT FOR THE DIRECTION THAT LOOP TAKES OVER THE FOREFINGER) Barb: ... MIMI: THIS PULLING CAUSES THE SHUTTLE 2 THREAD TO SHORTEN. clesliea: barb check you don't have pop up blocked MIMI: SHE THEN TIES THAT THREAD OFF ON HER PINKY INT EH USUAL WAY MIMI: LOOM LOOKS EXACTLY THE SAME, DOESN'T IT!! Greengal: Thanks for the class MIMI it has really helped me AKTATTER: it does but I see the difference now Barb: thanks clesliea I'll check that. clesliea: i agree it does MIMI: AND IT DIDN'T TAKE A HUGE NUMBER OF LINES OF TEXT SCROLLING UP AND DISORIENTING EVERYONE:) claudia: im looking at it.. MIMI: YOU'RE WELCOME GREENGAL MIMI: SO "NEW" IS PROBABLY BETTER Winkerbill: Thanks for the class Mimi. It's so nice to "see" you again. MIMI: SOMEDAY IF SHE GIVES PERMISSION I MAY WRITE INSTRUCTIONS FOR IT Katie Verna/occhitat: That Elisa! How can she make so many clunies in a design---apparently as effortlessly as tatting rings? Winkerbill: I've got to run. Winkerbill: goodnight everyone! Cynthia: Mimi thank you very much. I will master it now that I have conquered it Barbara M: Which different loom are you referring to? Winkerbill left the chat 20 hours ago Cynthia: bye Steph CelticDreamWeaver: nite Steph MIMI: YOU'RE VERY WELCOME CYNTHIA clesliea: my guess is she learned the cluny from you in the first place MIMI: BARBARA, IT'S A VARIATION IN HOW ONE PUTS THE LOOM THREAD ON THE FINGERS OF THE LOOM HAND CelticDreamWeaver: I am going to get going also claudia: i must go.. thanks mimi and georgia!! it was a wonderful class!! CelticDreamWeaver: take all clesliea: at least from your site Barb: Mimi.. Earlier you said something about someone usng a 'toe hold" What did you mean by that? Cynthia: I could not yet teach it but I cn at least make one that is beginning to look right! Barbara M: Which website? MIMI: SHE DID CONNIE - THAT IS, IF MY BAD FRENCH TRANSLATED HER EMAIL PROPERLY. Paule: Thank you Mimi; you made me TRY MIMI: BUT SHE MADE IT BETTER! MIMI: BARB- TOE HOLD IS JUDI BANASHEK'S PERSONAL DESIGN FOR A HAND-HELD PLASTIC LOOM THAT SHE SELLS MIMI: IT HAS PROJECTIONS OFN THE TOP THAT LOOK LIKE TOES! Cynthia: We will do some work on the kite next week after the intro class... Barb: Thank you Mimi. :) MIMI: SHE DESIGNED IT TO ALLOW HER TO WEAVE LEAVES WIDER THAN 3 LOOM THREADS. SHE CAN DO UP TO 9 clesliea: I have many looms but not that one. MIMI: BARBARA WEBSITE LINKS ARE ABOVE IN TEH LOG HERE. Cynthia: Judy would! LOL Barb: Wow! That's cool Mimi. clesliea: still it's easiest by hand I think Paule: Wow! How do you close them all? Barbara M: Mimi, which website shows the different loom technique, please? MIMI: NOT IF YOU WANT 5, 7, OR 9 LOOM THREADS CONNIE :) Barb: I'm having problems with the links, they won't work most of the time when I click on them. Cynthia: carefully...lol sorry Paule I couldn't resist MIMI: THOSE WIDER LEAVES LOOK A BIT BLOBBY TO ME. BUT THEY SERVE THEIR PURPOSE. SHE HAS AN ATTRACTIVE DESIGN Barbara M: Thanks. clesliea: where do you get Judi's loom MIMI: WITH ONE IN HER BOOK, ADVANCED TATTING PATTERNS + MIMI: FROM JUDI BANASHEK HERSELF MIMI: I'M AFRAID I'VE SEEN THEM NOWEHRE ELSE Greengal: Is there a class next week? MIMI: IF THE VIDEO LINKS DON'T WORK Cynthia: I'll track down an address and let you know Mimi and Georgia MIMI: TRY FROM ELISADUSUD'S BLOG Rosemarie: Barb, I'm having the same problem - all through class. clesliea: LOL like i'll be able to close one of those bad boys MIMI: I'LL TRY TYPING IT IN SO IT DOESN'T GET SHORTENED UP Cynthia: Yes there is a regular class next week Greengal: On Monday? MIMI: CAN'T CLICK ON IT BUT YOU CAN RETYPE IN YOUR BROWSER MIMI: http: // elisadusud.canalblog.com​ Cynthia: the yahoo calendar is not working as before. on Thursday is the beginner class start MIMI: LOOK UNDER "APPRENTISSAGE" FOR VIDEOS 2 AND 3 MIMI: C'EST BON? MIMI: ;) Cynthia: Georgia does the ongoing class start next Monday? Barb: thank you. MIMI: OK I'D BETTER LOG OFF SOON, NEED TO DRIVE HOME TO FEED STARVING HUSBAND MIMI: ANY MORE QUESTIONS? clesliea: Good nite drive safe and thanks again claudia: good night!!! Greengal: thanks MIMI: YOU'RE WELCOME ALL. IT'S SO FUN TO TEACH ENTHUSIASTIC STUDENTS Barbara M: Good night, Mimi. Rosemarie: Thanks again for the class and goodnight. JB: Thank you for the class. I will practice. Good night and Be safe. Barbara M: Thank you so much. Barb: Thank you Mimi! I made one cluny leaf before, but never got back to them. claudia: thanks a lot Katie Verna/occhitat: No, Mimi, you did a great job! Thanks so much! It's an honor to meet you over clunies again. Dawn: Thanks you!!!! MIMI: NOW YOU ALL KNOW WHERE TO FIND THE INSTRUCTIONS SO YOU CAN GO BACK AND LOOK AGAIN Barb: Now I want to make some more. :) FLTATTER joined the chat 20 hours ago MIMI: WHEN INSPIRED BY SOME PRETTY PATTERN YOU FIND tatpat1: Thank you very much. Paule: Thank you Mimi; very good class! MIMI: KATIE, HONOR SHMONOR. YOU'RE AN LPS BUDDY AND ALWAYS WILL BE Cynthia: Mimi I tip my shuttle and hat to your skill with the cluny and teaching us how to do it as well MIMI: YOU NEED TO COME SEE US SOMETIME skfuller: Thanks again Mimi Katie Verna/occhitat: You sweetie, Mimi! Katie Verna/occhitat: Don't I wish! MIMI: SEE YA'LL SEPT 20 WHEN WE ALL TRY TO FIGURE OUT HOW ELISA MAKES THOSE TIDY FLOWER CENTERS!! skfuller: I hadn't made any for over 15 yrs and wow all I had this afternoon were knots and tangles skfuller: Tonight I finally made a long skinny one! bmedina: Good bye and thank you MIMI: I knew it woudl come back to you Susan! Bill: k MIMI: Good night all, happy weaving!! bmedina left the chat 20 hours ago Barb: .. tatpat1: Good night all. Katie Verna/occhitat: nite, nite, everyone! MIMI left the chat 20 hours ago Bill: Another Great Class! AKTATTER: good for you sue FLTATTER: yes it is AKTATTER: night mimi AKTATTER: good night all see you on the 20th Dawn: thanks eveyone have a good night !!!! Cynthia: I'm going to call it a night unless someone has a question for me about next week's regular class AKTATTER left the chat 20 hours ago Barb joined the chat 20 hours ago Barbara M: Good night all & thanks. Dawn: when is the regular classes Barb joined the chat 20 hours ago JB: Good night all Cynthia: Barb we both needed the velcro tonight }{}{}{}{}{}{}{ ============================================================ Created at Chatzy.com